Why GFCIs

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iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
There have been some recent posts asking about the necessity for GFCI protection when the equipment has an EGC.

The other night I was working at another supermarket and decided to look at the deli slicers. It does not matter what store this is, I see the same things, including the grim, at every supermarket.


OK four typical deli slicers

IMG_20151002_033645493_HDR_zpscaptlv2n.jpg



First plug I looked at
IMG_20151002_033701867_zpsq5yqpiuh.jpg


Second plug
IMG_20151002_033705763_zpsadzwmq5a.jpg



The third slicer plug was fine.


The fourth had already been repaired
IMG_20151002_033728066_zpswg1o9ltq.jpg


But wait, what about that other plug supplying a wrapping machine?
IMG_20151002_033734086_zpsoaxylxk6.jpg





Given the choice I would rather use a equipment with an intact EGC but having a GFCI as a back up seems like a good idea.
 

goldstar

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
Any idea why they cut the grounds off ? Are these machines notorious for ground fault problems ?

BTW, just a side bar to this thread, I would get used to using these : http://www.uline.com/BL_1017/Microflex-Diamond-Grip-Gloves While the area you're working in looks clean there's no telling what you end up touching in a supermarket. Scrubbing grease, grime and graphite out of your hands could damage your skin severely.;)
 

mbrooke

Batteries Included
Location
United States
Occupation
Technician
How is it they managed to break the ground and not the hots? :blink: Ive seen this with vending machines but deli slicers?

BTW, how are those LED retrofits turning out?
 

mbrooke

Batteries Included
Location
United States
Occupation
Technician
Yes, typical. Should be called normal abuse.

I think employees and cleaning crews need better training across the board. I see this with other equipment and it always amazes me. Then again I am a bit more aware of electricity so handling cords comes naturally.

I still think we should have implemented this:
 

bphgravity

Senior Member
Location
Florida
CPSC Report (November 2012) – “The three most common product categories associated with electrocutions over the 3-year period 2007–2009 were: “Small Appliance” (22 electrocutions), “Large Appliance” (19 electrocutions), and “Power Tool” (10 electrocutions). Also, in 2009, a larger percentage of the electrocutions occurred during repair work by consumers at residential locations than in the prior 2 years.”
 

GoldDigger

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Placerville, CA, USA
Occupation
Retired PV System Designer
When the cord is pulled sideways rather than straight out the torque just bends the flat hot blades and they pull out. The tubular brass ground is too rigid in that direction to bend and breaks off at the weakest point, the base, instead.
 

mbrooke

Batteries Included
Location
United States
Occupation
Technician
When the cord is pulled sideways rather than straight out the torque just bends the flat hot blades and they pull out. The tubular brass ground is too rigid in that direction to bend and breaks off at the weakest point, the base, instead.

Ahhh, that makes sense.

This might not go over well for asking, but should the CMP perhaps mandate a different type of plug here? Yes a GFCI helps, but even those can fail to. Cleaning solvents going up into these outlets looks like another real world problem regarding these environments.
 

peter d

Senior Member
Location
New England
I think employees and cleaning crews need better training across the board. I see this with other equipment and it always amazes me. Then again I am a bit more aware of electricity so handling cords comes naturally.

I still think we should have implemented this:

:happyno::happyno:

I have no issue with GFCI protection other than the controversial requirement for dishwashers as well as everything located within 6' of a residential sink.
 

peter d

Senior Member
Location
New England
In the case of these deli machines with the missing EGC, a fault will still cause a shock but the GFCI will hopefully limit the duration of that shock assuming they are still functional. This is where the new UL self test requirements come into play. An intact EGC would remove the hazard immediately via a tripped OCPD.

Myself, I can credit a receptacle GFCI for sparing me from receiving a serious shock due to someone's hacked up jobsite modification to a large Greenlee bender I was using. I did get shocked but it was quickly interrupted by the GFCI before it really began to hurt and leave after affects.
 
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