Jim W in Tampa
Senior Member
- Location
- Tampa Florida
What exactly is a unit switch.Is the one on the wall not a switch for the unit ?Or does it need to be part of the disposal ?
al hildenbrand said:I love this one.
Light on = OFF
Light off = ON
The perversity of that goes to my point.
marinesgt0411 said:Can not help it that is the way the lighted decora switch is if the switch is lit up it is off and when you turn the switch on it is no longer lit
Jim W in Tampa said:What exactly is a unit switch.Is the one on the wall not a switch for the unit ?Or does it need to be part of the disposal ?
422.34 Unit Switch(es) as Disconnecting Means.
A unit switch(es) with a marked-off position that is a part of an appliance.......
Jim W in Tampa said:And then it nolonger removes all voltage from the unit so is now not a disconnect
marinesgt0411 said:That can be said for any switch
Jim W in Tampa said:Only if it has this light in series.Simple toggle switches remove voltage.
Will someone please tell me what the motor controller looks like for a disposal? I can't remember ever seeing one!iwire said:...
That being the case we must apply the rules of 422.32
...422.32 Disconnecting Means for Motor-Driven Appliance.
If a switch or circuit breaker serves as the disconnecting means for a permanently connected motor-driven appliance of more than 1/8 hp, it shall be located within sight from the motor controller and shall comply with Part IX of Article 430.
Exception: If a motor-driven appliance of more than 1/8 hp is provided with a unit switch that complies with 422.34(A), (B), (C), or (D), the switch or circuit breaker serving as the other disconnecting means shall be permitted to be out of sight from the motor controller.
Smart $ said:Will someone please tell me what the motor controller looks like for a disposal? I can't remember ever seeing one!
VII. Motor Controllers
430.81 General.
Part VII is intended to require suitable controllers for all motors.
(A) Definition. For the definition of Controller, see Article 100. For the purpose of this article, a controller is any switch or device that is normally used to start and stop a motor by making and breaking the motor circuit current.
Controller. A device or group of devices that serves to govern, in some predetermined manner, the electric power delivered to the apparatus to which it is connected.
marinesgt0411 said:It is a lighted switch THE LIGHT IS IN THE SWITCH if the light is on the switch is open and no voltage is going down the switch leg any more then any other switch that is open has any voltage going down the switch leg.
Jim W in Tampa said:With all the lockouts being required it seems like its time for panel doors to have a cheap lock already in them.But then inspectors would need to find something else to pick on.The reinspect charges make them plenty.
Exactly my point... and therein lies the dilemma. If the countertop switch IS the controller, the disconnecting means of 422.32 is in addition to it.iwire said:LOL, I am pretty sure you have seen one.
Yes a 15 amp single pole switch if intended to stop and start a motor is a motor controller.
The disconnecting switch or circuit breaker of 422.32 requires it to be within sight from the controller, not the motor. This implies it is ahead of the controller. Additionally, 422.32 states the disconnecting means shall comply with Part IX of Article 430. Subpart 430.102 requires a disconnect for BOTH the controller and the motor.iwire said:Not if the disposal in more than [1/8] HP.Jim W in Tampa said:So just apply 422.31b and give him a breaker lock,problem solved
If it is we have to also apply 422.32
Then the decora switch is still the controller and the under the sink switch is the motor disconnect. Where's the 430.102(A) disconnect for the controller (within sight from the controller)?iwire said:Put the decora back and install another switch under the sink that is an indicating type.
marinesgt0411 said:If you want to keep it a decora switch just get a lighted decora switch light on its off light off its on to me thats indicating.
don_resqcapt19 said:Panel cover locks are never suitable for use a lockout devices. The circuit breaker that serves the equipment being worked on must be individually locked out to comply with safe work rules.
Don
Dave58er said:So if I Lockout/Tagout the switchboard or disconnect feeding the panel I'm working out of that is not following safe work rules?
What if I use a lockout device designed to lockout the main of the panel I'm working in?
Again I will stand by my original statement that panel locks are not acceptable because they are without a tagout provision.
Anyone who has seen these panel locks knows they are all keyed alike and there is nothing to prevent someone from unlocking them. With out a tag they have no way of knowing why that breaker is off.
I've seen many maintenence people open a (locked) panel and turn on breakers at random.
Cavie said:Jim, the inspector was wrong and making up his own code. There is no exception for Residential. I still say, do away with the lock out and install a disconect.