Conduit Routing at Ceiling

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clausb

Member
Location
Rutland, Vermont
An industrial client noticed that the electrical contractor routed raceways in the flutes of the roof deck, above the top of the bar joists. The client claims that this is a code violation; that any future roof work could damage the wiring when roofing is screwed down and the screws penetrate the deck into the space and could possible penetrate the raceway. This seems to be a valid concern, but I do not see that this is specifically prohibited by the NEC. Has anyone else heard of this concern before or if any municipalities have amendments to the code on this?
 

pete m.

Senior Member
Location
Ohio
To my knowledge this is not a violation of the NEC although it is a real concern. I have witnessed just what the building owner is concerned about.

Pete
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
Re: Conduit Routing at Ceiling

I do this myself and will continue to do so if job specs allow and the NEC does not change.

As much as putting them high in the ribs exposes them to the roofers it keeps them safe from duct guys and other trades.

It's a trade off as are most decisions.

clausb said:
The client claims that this is a code violation; that any future roof work could damage the wiring when roofing is screwed down and the screws penetrate the deck into the space and could possible penetrate the raceway.

If I run conduits through walls any work on the walls may damage the conduits.

IMO a lot of this could be addressed by the roofers.

If they stopped using screws that are often 2" to 10" to long they might stop hitting things. :roll:
 

Jim W in Tampa

Senior Member
Location
Tampa Florida
Re: Conduit Routing at Ceiling

iwire said:
I do this myself and will continue to do so if job specs allow and the NEC does not change.

As much as putting them high in the ribs exposes them to the roofers it keeps them safe from duct guys and other trades.

It's a trade off as are most decisions.

clausb said:
The client claims that this is a code violation; that any future roof work could damage the wiring when roofing is screwed down and the screws penetrate the deck into the space and could possible penetrate the raceway.

If I run conduits through walls any work on the walls may damage the conduits.

IMO a lot of this could be addressed by the roofers.

If they stopped using screws that are often 2" to 10" to long they might stop hitting things. :roll:

Job security :)
 

growler

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,GA
I don't know why anyone would want to run pipe like this for an Industrial application. But, there are commercial applications where it is actually in the job specs. Visit your local Publix Grocery. Did a couple about 12 years ago and running above the bar joist was just what they wanted. My biggest concern was over heat, that near the roof. It must work out Ok for them because they do a bunch of them like that.
 

steve66

Senior Member
Location
Illinois
Occupation
Engineer
Any roofer that runs a screw through a conduit is just plain determined to destroy something. You can't tell me they don't know the difference between running a screw through sheet metal and drilling through conduit.

Steve
 

Jim W in Tampa

Senior Member
Location
Tampa Florida
steve66 said:
Any roofer that runs a screw through a conduit is just plain determined to destroy something. You can't tell me they don't know the difference between running a screw through sheet metal and drilling through conduit.

Steve

They would not be able to tell untill it was too late.Also you would slow there job down ,but long as you dont mind paying extra.
 

fishin' electrician

Senior Member
Location
Connecticut
I run conduit this way all the time as well. Makes for a really clean looking installation and when everything is sprayed (usually an off white) it almost disappears.

Oh, and it's the darndest thing, when I attach my boxes and straps, I don't use screws that are so long that they compromise the integrity of the roof.
 

jes25

Senior Member
Location
Midwest
There is nothing wrong woth running pipe in this manner. Its not the electrcians fault people drill in to the raceway. What about wires in kitchens when they use 2" screws on the cabinets. What about recess panels. Maybe, just maybe, people should pay attention when they do remodeling work.

That would be like drilling out a floor joist and then blaming the plumber for putting a pipe there......He should know they are gonna add circuits!!

Give me a break :roll: This is a fine way to do it.
 

RUWired

Senior Member
Location
Pa.
If the metal decking is already in place and the insulation board and plywood is down, future roof repairs are most likely only going to be rubber or asphalt.Suggest to he EC to wait untill all the boards are in place if this is just starting or get the roofer in gear.
Rick
 

tshea

Senior Member
Location
Wisconsin
Here's another one:
Running conduit and boxes on the roof--before insulation, deck boards, tar and gravel--hole saw for the 4/O box for lighting.

I've been doing this for years and have not had any problems. The roofers know what's going on and avoid electricity like the plague.
 

allenwayne

Senior Member
Was involved in a 4 building complex that had open finished trusses 5/4 t&g planking then we ran all conduit ,MC on top of the 5/4 and then insulated plywood was laid and attached with 4 in screws Now one would think that screwing wood to wood it would be quite noticable when conduit is in the path .NOT !!!!! several hits and they footed quite an expensive repair bill.
 

clausb

Member
Location
Rutland, Vermont
Thanks for the comments and commentary. It is great to hear both sides of the issue. Regarding my specifications, we are altering so that it instructs the contractors to install conduits to the underside of the top web of bar joists or to the bottom level of solid structural members. Granted this will not protect from super-long screws but will work with the properly selected screws.
 

colosparker

Senior Member
I work for a large school district with 60+ schools and 4 million square feet. Every year we are doing new roofs. Every year we run into problems when roofers run their screws through the deck and hit existing conduits. The only time we find out about it is when they short something out. I always try to get electrical contractors to stay out of the fluted deck channels when running new conduit. We have it written into the specs for new construction. Have argued with numerous electrician over the years about running conduit this way. When they ask me to show them where it is in NEC. I say read your specs.
 

LarryFine

Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
Location
Henrico County, VA
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
Re: Conduit Routing at Ceiling

clausb said:
The client claims that this is a code violation . . .
Anyone who makes such a claim should be able to cite the article number, just like an inspector. Ask.
 
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