50amp range circuit to island

[Peter Furrow]

We are starting a residential remodel tomorrow. Homeowner needs a 50 amp range circuit to an island. I’d like to run NM-B wire (romex) from the panel that’s on the opposite end of the house to the island. Homeowner is going to channel the concrete to the nearest framed wall. This means my NMB wire would be in a 1” conduit From the framed wall , in concrete 3” To the island.
I know I’m not supposed to have romex in a conduit especially if I go below the concrete into the soil because it’s a wet location.

I don’t want to pipe all the way back from the Island to the panel and use THWN.
Or
I doubt I’ll be able to get #6-3 MC at supply house. (MC is permissible under ground)
Or
I don’t want to run an NM-B from the panel and transition to conduit & THWN wire to go to the island. I would hate to have a splice point in my range circuit.
Hopefully this inspector will let me run the NMB wire in conduit approximately 10 feet from the framed wall to the island. If I keep the pvc 1” pipe in the concrete I should be OK.
But if I hit the soil with the conduit & NMB it would be considered a wet location and I might fail the inspection.
Any thoughts?


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[Dennis Alwon]

Find a spot where you can run the nm and install a box. Then pipe to the island from there

 

[wwhitney]

6/3 UF sleeved in the slab?

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Coppersmith]

Find a spot where you can run the nm and install a box. Then pipe to the island from there

This is what I do with all island circuits.

 

[Peter Furrow]

This is what I do with all island circuits.

Yeah but in that case I have to splice the circuit. I hate splicing a circuit with a heavy load draw because the wire nuts burn up sometimes. But I guess that’s my only choice.
Provide a junction box and transition to pipe to the island


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[LarryFine]

Even if it ends up in a closet, the J-box is a good idea. Use split-bolts and tape, not wire-nuts.

A deep 2-gang box will give you plenty of room.

 

[infinity]

Electricians splice #6 wire all of the time. As long as it's done correctly with the proper wire connectors it should never be a problem. For a 50 amp circuit you could use #8 THWN in the raceway in the concrete. What size range is it?

 

[FionaZuppa]

Hopefully this inspector will let me run the NMB wire in conduit approximately 10 feet from the framed wall to the island. If I keep the pvc 1” pipe in the concrete I should be OK.
But if I hit the soil with the conduit & NMB it would be considered a wet location and I might fail the inspection.
Any thoughts?


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So if the "conduit" (which it would not be in this case) was encapsulated in concrete, wouldn't it just be considered a physical protection barrier?

To be even more "solid", use the UF wire instead (or ask AHJ if 1. NM as you propose is ok, and if not then 2. ask if its ok with UF wire). Or maybe the protection pipe needs to be 1.5" to allow more air, the ends will be open, right?

AHJ has final say-so.

 

[AC\DC]

You can run nmb in conduit for the protection. It’s the slap that is the issue. If it’s in contract with earth it’s wet, if it’s not your good.

 

[hillbilly1]

Even if it ends up in a closet, the J-box is a good idea. Use split-bolts and tape, not wire-nuts.

A deep 2-gang box will give you plenty of room.

Split bolts? People still use those? LOL! Polaris taps!

 

[FionaZuppa]

Split bolts? People still use those? LOL! Polaris taps!

home run it, done.

 

[winnie]

Split bolts? People still use those? LOL! Polaris taps!

Would not trust wire-nuts for a 50A circuit.

IMHO something like http://www.nsiindustries.com/catalo...tors/polaris-black-insulated-connectors/ito-4 is the way to go. Split bolts are cheaper but much more labor intensive. Use split bolts if your time is cheap.

-Jon

 

[Peter Furrow]

Split bolts? People still use those? LOL! Polaris taps!

Are split bolts with tape permissible?
Honestly I’ve never seen a split bolt termination go bad. Every split bolt connection I’ve ever come across to the test of time and lasted for years. I just don’t know if it’s permissible these days.


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[hillbilly1]

Are split bolts with tape permissible?
Honestly I’ve never seen a split bolt termination go bad. Every split bolt connection I’ve ever come across to the test of time and lasted for years. I just don’t know if it’s permissible these days.


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Yeah, its still permissible.

 

[winnie]

Split bolts with proper taping are perfectly acceptable, simply lots of work.

-Jon

 

[curt swartz]

Standard MC is not rated for direct burial or concrete encasement. You have to use the jacketed type.

For 15 and 20 amp circuits we almost always pull UF cable in a raceway to an island on a slab. It saves having to make a transition to a cable wiring method at the wall but more importantly it allows more flexibility for placement at the island. Trying to get an exact location of the island back wall is almost impossible. We stub the conduit up roughly in the center of the cabinet then the cable can get adjusted in the toe kick to the exact location. I don't remember pulling a larger circuit to an island on a slab recently but would definite consider 6/3 UF.

 

[FionaZuppa]

Standard MC is not rated for direct burial or concrete encasement. You have to use the jacketed type.

I dont think anyone is suggesting direct bury the wire. Sleeve it in encased concrete.

 

[texie]

I dont think anyone is suggesting direct bury the wire. Sleeve it in encased concrete.

I dont think anyone is suggesting direct bury the wire. Sleeve it in encased concrete.

That would still require jacketed/wet location MC.

 

[FionaZuppa]

That would still require jacketed/wet location MC.

Whats the def for "Locations, Wet" in the NEC ver in play here?
Some slabs may not be in direct contact with earth, so I say here....... it depends.

But sure, just use wet rated wire, sleeve it, home run it, done.

 

[Chamuit]

Would not trust wire-nuts for a 50A circuit.

I've seen 50-year-old connections made with wire nuts. No issues. Just don't wrap the dang nut with black tape, blech!