I'm done fooling around with bad drywall installers.

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Coppersmith

Coppersmith

Senior Member
Location
Tampa, FL, USA
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
It is extremely rare that I find drywall that is installed correctly, but I had some hope for this last job. The framing and wall covering was being done by a GC and his son. They showed up just as I was finishing a rough-in. I explained to him all the ways I see drywall installed incorrectly, how it makes my job much harder, how I'm going to charge the client extra to fix each of the problems around my boxes and suggest he backcharge the GC, and could he please install correctly. He assured me he was a consummate professional and would never install anything but perfection.

I came to do the trim and find large gaps around many of my boxes and wallboard that is not flat against the studs so my boxes are too far back. I'm having to install shims behind the receptacles because they are sinking into the wall. So I've come to the realization that this is never going to get better and from now on I'm going to either use adjustable depth boxes or Caddy levelers for every box. This is going to make the bid price higher, but will improve my sanity. If anybody has a product that works better, please let me know.
 
Sorry but you are looking at it all wrong. When there is a box that didn't get cut out, I will do that and I will push the sheetrock back till the nails pop. It is the sheetrock guys who are responsible for the fix. If they haven't mud around my boxes then they come back. Why would you shim or add box extensions etc if they do a bad job.

Fortunately I have had the opportunity to work around, mostly good rockers. One company is excellent and he usually did many of the jobs I was on. If there was an issue he wanted to know about it but there rarely was a problem.
 
On our last project a large apartment complex we used the adjustable depth covers on 4 11/16" boxes and that pretty much eliminated the drywall issues. Some walls are single rock, some double rock so the adjustable covers means less stock and eliminates guys from installing the wrong size covers.
 
Drywall/drywalers are perhaps the most frustrating thing in the trade. I am also on the verge of charging the client extra for the extra time it takes me to do finish. Granted I have been doing this for 20 years, but I just dont get how hardly anyone understands how a device interfaces with the drywall and nearly everyone seems to think plates are like 4x6 inches. Also frustrating when there is not a single English speaking person on the crew so I cant go over anything such as wires to be poked out or covered over. (nothing against immigrants here, Im just a typical dumb single language american and I need to communicate with other traces in English).
 
I've yet to find one that can do it without messing my boxes, or missing one. Why is it a 1/2" sheetrock leaves the box recessed an 1/8 or more when I set them to 1/2". Or a 4sq with a 1/2" mud ring that never clears the rock and left with a hump that the covers don't want to set flat on.
 
It's not entirely the fault of individual drywallers, the fault lies with the endustry as a whole. They've allowed themselves the become a cheap trade by cutting each other to pieces on pricing. A penny here, a nickel there....and now they're doing it for $.90 - $.95 per square foot. And now the whole industry has to do crappy work just to eat

I've done a lot of drywall, and I'm good at it. But I can't charge what those clowns charge.

I had a remodeling company owner ask if I do whole jobs, after I patched my own damage on a job. Wanted to get better work. I said I can sometimes. He asked if I can do $1.00/sf and I told him he's smoking crack. So he says "that's what I pay my other guys"

I said "and you're looking for better work"
 
James L said:
It's not entirely the fault of individual drywallers, the fault lies with the endustry as a whole. They've allowed themselves the become a cheap trade by cutting each other to pieces on pricing. A penny here, a nickel there....and now they're doing it for $.90 - $.95 per square foot. And now the whole industry has to do crappy work just to eat

I've done a lot of drywall, and I'm good at it. But I can't charge what those clowns charge.

I had a remodeling company owner ask if I do whole jobs, after I patched my own damage on a job. Wanted to get better work. I said I can sometimes. He asked if I can do $1.00/sf and I told him he's smoking crack. So he says "that's what I pay my other guys"

I said "and you're looking for better work"
Click to expand...

Yeah seems like just about everybody thinks "drywall is drywall" but it definitely isnt. Love the mongrel crews that way overdrive the screws - you lose all the strength when you drive it thru the paper :(
 
electrofelon said:
Yeah seems like just about everybody thinks "drywall is drywall" but it definitely isnt. Love the mongrel crews that way overdrive the screws - you lose all the strength when you drive it thru the paper :(
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Those mongrels don't know what a drywall screwgun is. They think they can do just as good a job with impact drivers 🙄

But that's also why some municipalities have screw inspections. Spacing and depth matter.

Then finishing is another story altogether
 
I find that excessive adhesive used on the stud face pushes the board out a lot and proper box depth is compromised.

I get it that we should have the drywallers come back and repair,but that doesn't always fit in with trimming everything out in one trip and powering up.

I will use box extenders, etc in order to complete my job and back charge the General Contractor.

A couple bills with labor at $70/hr for fixing screw ups gets attention immediately.

Surprising how the next job is hung and finished so much better.
 
Let me drop this bomb, too...

Electricians are notorious for having atrocious looking makeup inside the boxes. Drywall guys can tell if you give a crap what kind of work you leave.

And if you don't care what your work looks like inside the box, they won't care what their work looks like around your boxes.

Be your best, and it can make a lasting impression.

Here's a couple shots of my makeup. I have a leg to stand on when i complain about others' work 👍
 

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James L said:
Let me drop this bomb, too...

Electricians are notorious for having atrocious looking makeup inside the boxes. Drywall guys can tell if you give a crap what kind of work you leave.

And if you don't care what your work looks like inside the box, they won't care what their work looks like around your boxes.

Be your best, and it can make a lasting impression.

Here's a couple shots of my makeup. I have a leg to stand on when i complain about others' work 👍
Click to expand...
You use yellow wire nuts to make up your grounds?
 
James L said:
Let me drop this bomb, too...

Electricians are notorious for having atrocious looking makeup inside the boxes. Drywall guys can tell if you give a crap what kind of work you leave.

And if you don't care what your work looks like inside the box, they won't care what their work looks like around your boxes.

Be your best, and it can make a lasting impression.

Here's a couple shots of my makeup. I have a leg to stand on when i complain about others' work 👍
Click to expand...


Nice work. I always try and get my wires back as far as possible so they don't roto zip the wires. In the old days they would take a keyhole saw and just cut without thinking
 
I feel your pain.
Oversized openings is inexcusable and should be caught and fixed by the drywaller, plasterer or painter before we get to it. But that's why I always have joint compound or Durabond mix with me to keep the project moving forward.
The depth of the box is on the electrician.
When one of my boxes get covered up and I think it's an honest mistake, I'll use a 4' level and a short piece of snake to locate it.
If I think it was just laziness then I tell them to find it or I will, with my hammer.. literally.
This is how it's always been though in one extreme or another. Drywallers bother us we bother painter's
Designers and architect's bother all the trades.
It's a vicious circle.;)
 
Dennis Alwon said:
Nice work. I always try and get my wires back as far as possible so they don't roto zip the wires. In the old days they would take a keyhole saw and just cut without thinking
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Thanks. I learned a long time ago from the best boss I ever had. He said if you don't make up your wires into the back of the box, you are at the mercy of the drywaller. He's going to chop them all up with his Rotozip - or the best you can hope for is the drywaller shove the handle of his hatchet in your box and cram the wires back.

Then you have an impossible time getting the wires pulled back out when you put the devices on, or you have chopped up wires. Time waster either way.
 
James L said:
It's not entirely the fault of individual drywallers, the fault lies with the endustry as a whole. They've allowed themselves the become a cheap trade by cutting each other to pieces on pricing. A penny here, a nickel there....and now they're doing it for $.90 - $.95 per square foot. And now the whole industry has to do crappy work just to eat

I've done a lot of drywall, and I'm good at it. But I can't charge what those clowns charge.

I had a remodeling company owner ask if I do whole jobs, after I patched my own damage on a job. Wanted to get better work. I said I can sometimes. He asked if I can do $1.00/sf and I told him he's smoking crack. So he says "that's what I pay my other guys"

I said "and you're looking for better work"
Click to expand...
You could see it happening years ago on jobs. You knew it was piece work by the extreme amount of waste. The hangers would get a full sheet, cut two feet off, and throw the rest on the floor, and do it again a few minutes later with another full sheet. You had to climb over piles of “scrap”. I wondered if it was their way of screwing the GC or whoever was paying them. The more sheets used the more they made.
 
That should be easily-enough remedied. Take the amount of drywall off the blueprint. When they give you their rate per square foot, tell them how many square feet need to be installed, multiply the two, and tell them how much you'll pay for it.
 
James L said:
I've done a lot of drywall, and I'm good at it. But I can't charge what those clowns charge.
Click to expand...
Same here, but I'm more like $75-100 per sheet, hanging and finishing. I use adhesive on ceilings, but not walls.

I make good, tight holes by measuring to the start of the close side and end of the far side, making a rectangle.

For ceiling boxes and recessed lights, I draw the square, I draw an X to find the center, then I hole-saw at the X.
 
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