Yikes! Solar panels and Inverter/Battery Backfeed Into Duplex Receptacle!

Status
Not open for further replies.
The inverter wont supply power to the male prongs unless its plugged in. It appears that it is designed to NOT backfeed the grid. Kinda cool actually, as long as people realize how far (not far) 320 watts gets you, and how critical a substantial clear view of the sky is.
 
electrofelon said:
The inverter wont supply power to the male prongs unless its plugged in. It appears that it is designed to NOT backfeed the grid. Kinda cool actually, as long as people realize how far (not far) 320 watts gets you, and how critical a substantial clear view of the sky is.
Click to expand...
Per the page: "As you produce solar electricity, it enters your home through the standard power outlet and is split up between any appliances using power and the home battery." Maybe the U.S. version is different.
 
Makes me wonder if they're going to engineer a true 120-volt inverter. Most inverters are 60/60 volt. If you try to plug one of those in, the service bond will short it out and poof..... there goes your inverter.
 
480sparky said:
Makes me wonder if they're going to engineer a true 120-volt inverter. Most inverters are 60/60 volt. If you try to plug one of those in, the service bond will short it out and poof..... there goes your inverter.
Click to expand...
Im pretty sure they have been available for a long time. I know you can get the cheap Chinese plug and play grid tie inverters, not sure if they are listed though.
 
electrofelon said:
Im not sure if you are disagreeing with something I said. By "grid" I meant the utility grid outside of the building.
Click to expand...
What makes you think it will stop at the service panel? There's no provision for disconnecting the house from the "grid".
 
sparkie001 said:
What makes you think it will stop at the service panel? There's no provision for disconnecting the house from the "grid".
Click to expand...
It says:

"The Smart Solar Panel and the Smart Battery will work together, using WiFi, to optimally use your solar power within your home and avoid back-feeding into the public grid. This way we can ensure that you really use 100% of your electricity, while avoiding having to deal with authorities."

And:

"Install this for permission free use of the Smart Solar Panel and/or the Smart Battery. Using two clamps to wrap around the main power lines in your breaker box, it will measure total electricity consumption in your home and report to you in real-time. You CraftStrom App will ensure that all of the electricity you produce will be used by you in your home."

IT seems that is how they are claiming that no interconnect agreement is required.
 
Even if the grid interactive inverter has effective anti-islanding protection, it will be a source of power that adds to the line source through the branch breaker and can therefore allow another load on the same circuit to draw more power then the circuit wiring is rated for.
(That is in addition to any problem about the inverter not being NRTL approved as a grid-interactive inverter.)
So far I have seen only one fully approved "plug-in" GTI system, and it uses a non-standard plug and requires an electrician to install the matching receptacle on a dedicated circuit that meets all of the backfeed rules all the way back to the service.

As for any protection by the Safety Gate Adapter to force use of a dedicated circuit, it seems to me that it cannot detect any loads that are already on the circuit before the inverter is plugged in. It may actually work to avoid the circuit overload argument that I made initially, but I suspect that it will also false trip on any dip in supply voltage, and also not detect a load which has a controlled power ramp-up.
 
Last edited:
480sparky said:
Backfeed-connect an inverter to any random receptacle and NOT have it backfeed the utility.
Click to expand...
A careful reading of the "system" description recognizes the device which attaches to the service panel and detects power backfeed and sends a WiFi throttling signal to the panel/inverter. Presumably this involves a current transformer set with split cores and a non-contact voltage phase sensor or the required plug-in power connection. (Otherwise or arguably in all cases, it would have to be installed by an electrician.) I works with the battery (also WiFi linked) to tell the battery to charge only when there is excess power available from the solar panel?
If the grid is down, using the system for emergency power would require manually opening the main breaker.

The whole thing seems far too complex and expensive to be justified by a mere 300 watt supplemental power source. No mention of adding additional 300 watt units.
I also have doubts about proper mounting of the solar panel for decent power production. The "balcony" they mention would have to be south facing.
 
GoldDigger said:
A careful reading of the "system" description recognizes the device which attaches to the service panel and detects power backfeed and sends a WiFi throttling signal to the panel/inverter. Presumably this involves a current transformer set with split cores and a non-contact voltage phase sensor or the required plug-in power connection. (Otherwise or arguably in all cases, it would have to be installed by an electrician.) I works with the battery (also WiFi linked) to tell the battery to charge only when there is excess power available from the solar panel?
If the grid is down, using the system for emergency power would require manually opening the main breaker.

The whole thing seems far too complex and expensive to be justified by a mere 300 watt supplemental power source. No mention of adding additional 300 watt units.
I also have doubts about proper mounting of the solar panel for decent power production. The "balcony" they mention would have to be south facing.
Click to expand...

OK, explain how it differentiates between the 120v coming in on the mains and the 120v being produced by the inverter. There's several quintillion electrons flowing through the conductor and some snap-on device magically knows which ones "don't belong and should be stopped from going one direction".
 
480sparky said:
OK, explain how it differentiates between the 120v coming in on the mains and the 120v being produced by the inverter. There's several quintillion electrons flowing through the conductor and some snap-on device magically knows which ones "don't belong and should be stopped from going one direction".
Click to expand...
All it has to do is prevent reverse energy flow on the incoming mains. That is easy.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top