Concrete encased electrode for residential home?
- Thread starter anbm
- Start date
- Status
- Location
- Bremerton, Washington
- Occupation
- Master Electrician
Yes and a ufer/cee is required to be used if available.
Terminator5047
Senior Member
- Location
- Saint Louis
- Occupation
- Electrician
especially with pex water pipes now
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
As rule is written, if qualifying rebar is present in the footing, you must use it, exception for existing construction
If no qualifying rebar 20 feet or more of 4 AWG in the footing makes it a CEE but that is optional.
There is coated rebar as well as some fiberglass reinforcement that sometimes could be used - those obviously are not qualifying for a CEE.
If no qualifying rebar 20 feet or more of 4 AWG in the footing makes it a CEE but that is optional.
There is coated rebar as well as some fiberglass reinforcement that sometimes could be used - those obviously are not qualifying for a CEE.
UFER ground is an option for new residential house?
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
It is not an option per NEC. All electrode must be used.
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
Here is the section
- Location
- Bremerton, Washington
- Occupation
- Master Electrician
Keep in mind when you use a ufer ground, no ground rods are required.
Where does it say this in code?
Not trying to be a smart aleck but read article 250 requirements for grounding electrodes.
hbiss
EC, Westchester, New York NEC: 2014
- Location
- Hawthorne, New York NEC: 2014
- Occupation
- EC
"Where none of these grounding electrodes exist, one or more of the
grounding electrodes specified in 250.52(A)(4) through
(A)(8) shall be installed and used."
You have to read 250.52.
-Hal
Got it, but I assume we can still have both ground rod plus ufer?
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
Sure but IMO it is a waste of time and materials with little gain.
- Location
- Bremerton, Washington
- Occupation
- Master Electrician
The resistance of a ufer ground is much much less than a ground rod. Since both are basically for lightning protection, all is needed is a ufer. If you can’t determine why the code does not require ground rods with a ufer, ask and I can explain it.
- Location
- Bremerton, Washington
- Occupation
- Master Electrician
Are your inspectors not requiring a cee/ufer? In my area, if it’s available, and not used, then you have to chip out concrete to connect to rebar
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician
As kwired Et al. stated if the rebar qualifies as a CEE then a CEE must be used. There are two ways to use a CEE one is using the rebar the other is using the aforementioned 20' of #4 or larger bare copper, your choice.
- Location
- Bremerton, Washington
- Occupation
- Master Electrician
And it’s not just residential homes, it’s any occupancy.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
Note how it says all electrodes described in A1 through A7 must be used if they are present. If a qualifying CEE is not present you do not have to make one. Still is an option however to make one - that is often where the 20 feet of #4 copper is used for a CEE. Same goes for qualifying water pipe electrode or building steel. If present you must use them but are not required to add them if they are not present. That covers items 1 through 3. Items 4 through 7 generally won't exist unless you intentionally add them. If items 1 through 3 don't exist you will be adding something because you still need at least one grounding electrode.
- Location
- Placerville, CA, USA
- Occupation
- Retired PV System Designer
The NEC only requires use of a UFER in new construction if the footer construction provides for one.
You can get into a real bind if the rebar qualifies to be a UFER but no connection was made to it before pouring. You then have to chip out concrete to make an attachment point.
Some jurisdicrtions, however, require a UFER in all new construction, even if you have to lay copper wire in the footer to create one. If you skip this step in those areas you are really in trouble.
You can get into a real bind if the rebar qualifies to be a UFER but no connection was made to it before pouring. You then have to chip out concrete to make an attachment point.
Some jurisdicrtions, however, require a UFER in all new construction, even if you have to lay copper wire in the footer to create one. If you skip this step in those areas you are really in trouble.
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
NC is behind the times on this one. I wish they would require it but what they say is when the electrician gets to the job the concrete encase electrode is not available so you don't need it.
When I was running the business we always installed a concrete encase electrode unless the builder poured without calling me. I had to stay on top of the situation.
When I was running the business we always installed a concrete encase electrode unless the builder poured without calling me. I had to stay on top of the situation.
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