Storage container swimming pool

[rojay]

Has anyone seen one of these- a 20-40ft metal shipping container that’s been converted into a swimming pool?
Basically a prewired assembly for the most part, strongly doubt that it’s a UL listed one though.
Part of the container has been sectioned off to house a subpanel and all pool equipment, looks like all you do is supply a feeder.

Ive been trying to figure out the NEC 680 requirements that would apply to it.
It has metal walls, vinyl liner, and holds more than 42” of water, so it looks like the code would see this as a permanently installed above ground pool.

Im thinking perimeter bonding and attaching to pool walls at 4 points?
What about a grounding electrode system? If a feeder is brought to the sectioned off equipment area of this pool structure would 250.32A apply?

Any thoughts?

 

[Little Bill]

This would be treated as a permanently installed pool. You would need to follow 680 and especially 680.26 for equipotential bonding. Also you need to GFCI protect everything that is required, including any 240V pool pump motors.

If the subpanel is not installed on the same building as the main service then you would need to install a GES.

 

[Mystic Pools]

I find it amazing in my industry the crazy stuff designers come up with for a swimming pool and have no idea the requirements to have it comply to building codes and electrical codes.
I'm thinking about converting a 72' Pinto into a hot tub......

 

[rojay]

This would be treated as a permanently installed pool. You would need to follow 680 and especially 680.26 for equipotential bonding. Also you need to GFCI protect everything that is required, including any 240V pool pump motors.

If the subpanel is not installed on the same building as the main service then you would need to install a GES.

Little Bill,
The pool and pool equipment/subpanel are installed outside, remote from the main building.
I agree that a GES is needed but was concerned about the best way to go about it.

I remember reading an article about the danger of electricians using the pool equipotential bonding system as a part of the GES for the main service.

While this is a subpanel we’re talking about, and no neutral to ground bonds will be made at the subpanel, if the ground rods were added within 5ft of the inside of the pool walls, wouldn’t the rods for the GES need to be attached to the pool bonding system possibly causing some of the same concerns?

Or should the GES for the pool be located outside of the 5ft perimeter bonding zone and the GEC protected in pvc from the pool equipment to that point?

 

[JFletcher]

I'm thinking about converting a 72' Pinto into a hot tub......

A hammer blow to the rear bumper will accomplish that. :lol:

*Cue the exploding Pinto scene from the movie Top Secret*

Wouldn't a pool made from a shipping container be in the ground? Above ground I think it would be a massive eyesore, and I would question the ability of the sides and bottom to remain intact if it was slam full of water. Anyone have a link to the manufacturer of this pool?

In the summers I ysed to line my pickup with some plastic and fill it with water.. No motor however... My kids loved it especially when we went to a 4th of July parade with it.... It gave new meaning to the term Car Pool.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

You are a bit confused on the issue of perimeter bonding.

680.52(B) Not Permitted for Use as Grounding Electrodes. The
following systems and materials shall not be used as grounding
electrodes:
(1) Metal underground gas piping systems
(2) Aluminum
(3) The structures and structural reinforcing steel described
in 680.26(B)(1) and (B)(2)

This does not mean that the equipotential bonding can't be connected to the pool panel. It just means you cannot use structural reinforcing steel of the pool as an electrode.

 

[rojay]

You are a bit confused on the issue of perimeter bonding.



This does not mean that the equipotential bonding can't be connected to the pool panel. It just means you cannot use structural reinforcing steel of the pool as an electrode.

Good point. Thanks for the clarification. Just because the code states that the perimeter bonding isn’t required to extend back to the pool panelboard, doesn’t mean it can’t.

 

[Mystic Pools]

Here's a bonding question.

I serviced a "pool" abut 35 years ago on the Hudson River/Rockland County side (western shore) that was originally a quarry. If I can remember, it was just a pump and filter at it's side, with pipes running down for suction and return. I can't if thee was a patio or not.

More recently I read an article in one of my trade mags about a quarry converted to a pool. Outfitted with the code compliant suctions, etc.. Pretty sure concrete was poured to make that happen and am guessing rebar used was bonded.

The first quarry I mentioned, what is the proper bonding set up for that? Obviously no metal components on the "structure"

BTW-Aside from the gas tank issue on the Pinto, they were very reliable vehicles. 170 or 200 6 cyl was unbreakable.
Mercury Bobact........

 

[Little Bill]

IMO, it should be treated the same as any non-conductive pool. Encircle the pool/water with a bonding halo, bond the water, and to any equipment. Also any metal/conductive things that are within the area required for bonding.

 

[Adamjamma]

IMO, it should be treated the same as any non-conductive pool. Encircle the pool/water with a bonding halo, bond the water, and to any equipment. Also any metal/conductive things that are within the area required for bonding.

and that bonding gets bonded to the main house bond as well, correct? Or am I wrong after watching the Holt discussions on pools?

 

[petersonra]

and that bonding gets bonded to the main house bond as well, correct? Or am I wrong after watching the Holt discussions on pools?

What do you mean by "main house bond" and how do you plan to bond to it?

I think the EGC is all that is required but I am no swimming pool expert.

 

[Adamjamma]

the same way we bond our amatuer radio antennas to the main bonding point.. 4 or 6 awg in a conduit underground from the nearest grounding point to the main entrance bonding point unless there is a bonding point closer... to keep from having a potentials difference

In Antenna bonding, even though we have our antenna radials in place, best practice and I believe new code now is to bond from ground rod at antenna to the home grounding system, along with a grounded coupler before entering the home from the antenna also grounded to main point.

 

[Little Bill]

and that bonding gets bonded to the main house bond as well, correct? Or am I wrong after watching the Holt discussions on pools?

The bonding grid for a pool is not required to be taken back to the service or any panel. It will be inadvertently be connected through the EGC from pump motor or other pool equipment that has an EGC and the bonding grid is tied to the lugs on that equipment.
But a direct connection to the system ground is not required. You're not trying to create a fault path with the grid, just putting everything at the same potential, thus the name "equipotential bonding grid".

 

[Adamjamma]

Ok. Was not trying to take it to panel or service but to the house ground system.. to keep everything as one ground plane...

 

[Little Bill]

Ok. Was not trying to take it to panel or service but to the house ground system.. to keep everything as one ground plane...

Where do you think the "house ground system" is?

 

[Adamjamma]

What do they call it now.. the earth grounding conductor equipotential bond? Where one grounds all water pipes, communication services, the main panel and any extraneous conductive parts to...located near where the main service enters the building between the earth grounding point and the main panel. Usually, at least in my case, a decent sized bar with a cover and a piece of aluminum that says do not remove.
But not inside the panel or inside the house.

 

[Little Bill]

What do they call it now.. the earth grounding conductor equipotential bond? Where one grounds all water pipes, communication services, the main panel and any extraneous conductive parts to...located near where the main service enters the building between the earth grounding point and the main panel. Usually, at least in my case, a decent sized bar with a cover and a piece of aluminum that says do not remove.
But not inside the panel or inside the house.

The word "equipotential" is only mention/used in 680 for pools, 547 for Agriculture, and one or two other places. It's not used for a service. The grounding is called GES (grounding electrode system) The GEC (grounding electrode conductor) can be connected anywhere from the weatherhead to the main panel. So it can be inside. It's mostly outside but some POCO have restrictions on putting it in the meter. The GES (grounding electrode system) is the grounding. The equipotential grid for a pool is not required to be tied to the GES. The two have totally different purposes but as I said, they will become connected through the EGC of equipment.

 

[Adamjamma]

Ok. Sorry.