Out of Town/Out of State Contractors

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jmellc

Senior Member
Location
Durham, NC
Occupation
Facility Maintenance Tech. Licensed Electrician
I'm sure we've discussed this before but my memory has faded out.

Even though work has gotten better since my years of being an EC, it is still a competitive market. My last couple of bosses have pulled their hair out, bidding as close as they can and still losing a lot of jobs. Yet, I see out of town and out of state EC's all the time and see them getting a pretty good share of the work.

How in the world can a guy that far away outbid a local EC? Travel is not cheap. Fuel and motels cost a fortune, as do meals and miscellaneous. And some come from areas where I know the labor is more costly.

Enlighten me please.
 

peter d

Senior Member
Location
New England
I'm in a very small state surrounded by bigger states to the north and west (try to figure them out :roll: ) that pretty much drives our local economy. I see the very same thing with many contractors coming down to work here, often coming over an hour to do large projects here. It must make economic sense to do that much traveling or they wouldn't be doing it.
 

__dan

Senior Member
New automated warehouse nearby (new 4 - 5 years ago), the automation package was from a European OEM engineering contractor and the installers were eastern european (I asked around lightly who ran the ethernet cabling wire ducts parallel with the drive load side TC ER cable duct ... hundreds of feet parallel and on the load side of hundreds of drives and cable bundles...).

I did not ask about licensing but someone had the idea that it was wiring of the machine and not "wiring inside the building" as the statute would say ...

Same warehouse is going up brand new this year and 5 miles closer to me, the older one ran soooo badly that space is going to be repurposed. Might take ten minutes some times to get data through to the far away robot.


Three months maybe to install a $25 million automation package. If they were hiring locally for it I would be looking forward to it.
 

romex jockey

Senior Member
Location
Vermont
Occupation
electrician
How in the world can a guy that far away outbid a local EC? Travel is not cheap. Fuel and motels cost a fortune, as do meals and miscellaneous. And some come from areas where I know the labor is more costly.

Enlighten me please.

because it's not apples/apples

for starters, they may not be electricians at all

~RJ~
 

oldsparky52

Senior Member
At one time in my life I ran the construction department for a pump and tank operation. We found that we made more money on out of town jobs than we did on in town jobs. What we finally understood is that when men are out of town, they want to finish and get home. They get to the job earlier, leave later, work harder.

While in town, they need to get off on time to get home, arrive at the job later, and expand the time to complete the job to the perceived time to complete it.

I don't know if this answers the OP's question, but I found it interesting when we discovered it.
 

romex jockey

Senior Member
Location
Vermont
Occupation
electrician
The math is simple....

A normal licensed ,permitted, inspected spark is worth $$$

Miantenance, home improvement, handymen etc, who don't own an nec , nor are held to it are worth $

~RJ~
 

Dennis Alwon

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Chapel Hill, NC
Occupation
Retired Electrical Contractor
Some contractors just need enough to get their beer money at the end of the week. :happyyes: Sad but I have seen that scenario around here.
 

growler

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,GA
My last couple of bosses have pulled their hair out, bidding as close as they can and still losing a lot of jobs. Yet, I see out of town and out of state EC's all the time and see them getting a pretty good share of the work.

How in the world can a guy that far away outbid a local EC? Travel is not cheap. Fuel and motels cost a fortune, as do meals and miscellaneous. And some come from areas where I know the labor is more costly.

Enlighten me please.

Many times you will notice that this local job is not the first job this out of town EC has done for this GC. Experience doing a certain type of structure and working with a known GC does have advantages.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
GC may pick someone they are familiar with even if slightly higher bid, I'd probably do that as well if in their shoes.

Other guy may have cheap labor or even cheap subcontractors they use for at least portions of the project, or maybe have better pricing from suppliers because of higher volume of purchases and that can help keep their bid lower.

Not all bids are strictly chosen on cost either. Proven performance ability can be worth any extra cost in some cases.

You need to sell your company and not just be the low bidder. If you only get jobs because you are low bidder, you probably not making a lot, and are almost always working crappy jobs.
 

ActionDave

Chief Moderator
Staff member
Location
Durango, CO, 10 h 20 min from the winged horses.
Occupation
Licensed Electrician
GC may pick someone they are familiar with even if slightly higher bid, I'd probably do that as well if in their shoes.....

That is what I have seen with hotels and big retailers, the same crews follow the GC.

When we did out of town work on cell sites it was because the contractor was looking for a specific skill set. The work was not hard. The skill set needed was to be very detailed and neat with your work, but more important than that it was being able to cope with the logistics and cumbersome bureaucracy of the cell companies. It was like dealing with the Federal Government.
 

cowboyjwc

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Simi Valley, CA
See it all the time and can't figure it out. I get the keeping a crew together, but I had a local guy call me for an inspection one time and I told him that it was interesting that we had never met before, he told me that it was his first job in town, he said that he had been mostly working in Riverside. I said seriously? The guys doing the job across the street are from Riverside, you guys probably pass each other on the way to work.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
That is what I have seen with hotels and big retailers, the same crews follow the GC.

When we did out of town work on cell sites it was because the contractor was looking for a specific skill set. The work was not hard. The skill set needed was to be very detailed and neat with your work, but more important than that it was being able to cope with the logistics and cumbersome bureaucracy of the cell companies. It was like dealing with the Federal Government.

And if you have already done many of the same (or very close to same) hotel, big retailer, fast food, etc. you already know how to trim some costs, may have somewhat of a working relationship with other subs and maybe even have worked out deals with plumber, HVAC, etc. where you work together somehow on certain aspects.
 

romex jockey

Senior Member
Location
Vermont
Occupation
electrician
That is what I have seen with hotels and big retailers, the same crews follow the GC.

When we did out of town work on cell sites it was because the contractor was looking for a specific skill set. The work was not hard. The skill set needed was to be very detailed and neat with your work, but more important than that it was being able to cope with the logistics and cumbersome bureaucracy of the cell companies. It was like dealing with the Federal Government.

The big box stores run crews around the country, the only time they'll solicit locally is if they need licensure/permits/inspections

That's the extend of them even wanting local yokels around

~RJ~
 

cdslotz

Senior Member
I had an EC friend of mine in the 90's that did Wal Marts all over Texas and other states.
He knew the exact cost, down to every nut/bolt/screw, for every floorplan that WalMart built.
I was estimating at another EC, so I've done those takeoffs on Wal Marts, and they are very complicated with controls, refrigeration wiring, prefered vendors, etc.
I bid a couple and got whipped by my friend, but he would make a very good profit on his jobs.
If I remember, there were GC's that specialized in Wal Marts too, and the GC's still had to get competitive bids from locals.
My friend would win every time....I'm pretty sure that if the competition was low or high, my friend probably got last look. The GC's already had my friend's number plugged in anyway.
These jobs, as with all retail, are fast track. The GC's didn't have that to worry about with an EC like my friend....
 

peter d

Senior Member
Location
New England
I had an EC friend of mine in the 90's that did Wal Marts all over Texas and other states.
He knew the exact cost, down to every nut/bolt/screw, for every floorplan that WalMart built.
I was estimating at another EC, so I've done those takeoffs on Wal Marts, and they are very complicated with controls, refrigeration wiring, prefered vendors, etc.
I bid a couple and got whipped by my friend, but he would make a very good profit on his jobs.
If I remember, there were GC's that specialized in Wal Marts too, and the GC's still had to get competitive bids from locals.
My friend would win every time....I'm pretty sure that if the competition was low or high, my friend probably got last look. The GC's already had my friend's number plugged in anyway.
These jobs, as with all retail, are fast track. The GC's didn't have that to worry about with an EC like my friend....

Pretty much the same here, the was a small handful of EC's that did all the big box retail in New England back when it was sprouting up in the late 90's, early 00's. Like your friend, they knew their costs and had it down to a science. There was no way anyone could touch them.
 

jaggedben

Senior Member
Location
Northern California
Occupation
Solar and Energy Storage Installer
Around here it would be because the guys doing the work can't afford the rent in the places the work is. But that doesn't explain, say, Simi Valley to Riverside. Seems like people would rather jump in the truck all day than try to build connections where they live. I blame the internet and the lack of a carbon tax.
 
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