Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Chinese hot tub not listed

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Chinese hot tub not listed

    My customer bought a hot tub and called me to connect it. I wired a future for the tub and left a disconnect six feet from the planned tub location. The tub came in and all the markings are in Chinese. After close inspection it is discovered that the tub is not listed by UL or any nationally recognized testing lab (NRTL). Now we have a situation where I cant connect the tub and the inspector cant pass the installation. The customer, Out $8000, Tries to return the tub and gets the runaround. Now I have an open permit for a tub that is approaching a year old and the customer has this big decoration on the patio.

    Is it legal for a US company (California) to sell unlisted electrical goods, specifically spas, in the US? Who has info about a "safety letter from the manufacturer? Has anyone else had a problem with "world" goods?

    #2
    It occurs here on occasion. Not sure of the legalities involved, but locally if the house permit is still "open", the electrician an and I explain to the homeowner that connecting a non-listed tub is not allowed due to the potential danger. At the E/Cs request the job is final-ed with a note on the final about the hot tub.
    In all probability they find someone who is willing to risk the liability to connect the tun after we leave
    At my age, I'm accustomed to restaurants asking me to pay in advance, but now my bank has started sending me their calendar one month at a time.

    Comment


      #3
      Ouch!

      UL, and probably others will offer field evaluations, for a cost. It may be cheaper than throwing out the tub, at least if it passes .

      But, does it even need to be listed? If you do not use flexible connections 680.42(A) I don't know that it has to be. Granted, we'd feel better if it was, but . . .

      Welcome to the forum.
      With great power comes great resistance - times current squared, of course.

      Comment


        #4
        can't you just get the circuit to the disconnect inspected?
        Then what ever happens, isn't your problem.
        -Todd-

        -Delawhere?

        [COLOR="Red"] Shock Me, [/COLOR][COLOR="Black"]Make Me Feel Better.[/COLOR]

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Volta View Post
          Ouch!

          UL, and probably others will offer field evaluations, for a cost. It may be cheaper than throwing out the tub, at least if it passes .

          But, does it even need to be listed? If you do not use flexible connections 680.42(A) I don't know that it has to be. Granted, we'd feel better if it was, but . . .

          Welcome to the forum.
          No it doesn't have to be listed. If it is listed it has to be installed per the manufactures instructions. I used to be way picker about non listed equipment, but no so much anymore. I'm only responsible for the wiring installation, what you hook to it is your's and the customers concern.

          You could call ETL or who ever they are now and you'll get a way better price than from UL. I would try to get the company that sold it to pay for it.
          I can build anything you want if you draw a picture of it on the back of a big enough check.

          [COLOR=red]There's no substitute for hard work....but that doesn't mean I'm going to give up trying to find one.[/COLOR]

          John Childress
          Electrical Inspector
          IAEI / CEI / C10
          Certified Electrical Inspector

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by ty View Post
            can't you just get the circuit to the disconnect inspected?
            Then what ever happens, isn't your problem.
            That's what I am thinking. If not, the inspector is your problem not the tub.
            [COLOR="Navy"]There are two kinds of people - those smart enough to know they donít know, and those dumb enough to insist they do[/COLOR].-----Margery Eagan

            [COLOR="DarkRed"]Open shop since 1988[/COLOR]

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by cowboyjwc View Post
              No it doesn't have to be listed.
              NC will require any electrical equipment to be listed by one of many NTRL that they have listed. I have always read the section below to mean we must use listed or labeled equip. I know others will disagree.

              110.3(B) Installation and Use. Listed or labeled equipment shall be installed and used in accordance with any instructions included in the listing or labeling.
              They say I shot a man named Gray and took his wife to Italy
              She inherited a million bucks and when she died it came to me
              I can't help it if I'm lucky

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Dennis Alwon View Post
                I have always read the section below to mean we must use listed or labeled equip. I know others will disagree.
                I will be an 'other':grin:, the NEC clearly does not require all equipment to be listed.

                If it did there would be no need for the number of specific sections that require listing. 90.7 talks about it in the first sentence.

                Comment


                  #9
                  FWIW Caddy clips are listed for 'positioning only' whatever that means :confused:, and lot of strut type products are not listed at all.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I do realize that not all fastening devices screws etc need to be listed but it seems odd to me. Article 680 hardly mentions listed except for a package spa or hot tub. Nowhere do I see a requirement for listing. Motors also -- what am I missing. I know darn well NC will not allow any of these equip. without listing. I have seen few places that require listing.
                    They say I shot a man named Gray and took his wife to Italy
                    She inherited a million bucks and when she died it came to me
                    I can't help it if I'm lucky

                    Comment


                      #11
                      The NEC does not require all motors to be listed and as far as I know UL does not list motors for ordinary locations.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Apparently in 2008 UL has started offering to list motors but the NEC still does not require it for most types.

                        http://www.ul.com/global/eng/pages/o...otors/listing/

                        Comment


                          #13
                          I guess it is an NC amendment because we were requiring listed luminaires long before the NEC required them. Seems odd fixtures must be listed but not swimming pool motors etc.
                          They say I shot a man named Gray and took his wife to Italy
                          She inherited a million bucks and when she died it came to me
                          I can't help it if I'm lucky

                          Comment


                            #14
                            I have no doubt that at some point in the future all parts will have to be listed. It is just the way things are headed with everyone trying to cover their rear.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Dennis Alwon View Post
                              ... I know darn well NC will not allow any of these equip. without listing. I have seen few places that require listing.
                              As far as I know, conduits typically need to be listed. So do FCC, NM, and UF cables, but not AC, FC, IGS, MV, MC, MI, TC, or type SE.

                              Busways do not need to be, nor bus plugs unless mounted in other than a horizontal position.

                              Not ground rods or metal boxes, unless thinner than standard. Nor straps, fuses, fuseholders, breakers, panelboards, disconnects, or switches.

                              Receptacles and attachment plugs do.

                              I may have missed some, maybe someone would be willing to point out any errors they find :grin:.
                              With great power comes great resistance - times current squared, of course.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X