680.42 Hot tub GFCI requirements

[WBrannen]

I am trying to interpret the requirements for GFCI protection on an outdoor residential hot tub install. The code in article 680.42 only addresses GFCI for cord and plug connected units. Does this mean if the unit is hard wire connected that it does not need a GFCI?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

That depends on wwhat code cycle you are under. 2008 NEC changed that req. 680.22(B). All 125v 15 or 20 amp circuits for pool pumps whether cord and plug or direct wired need gfci protect

 

[infinity]

I'm not so sure he's asking solely about the pump being GFCI protected.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I'm not so sure he's asking solely about the pump being GFCI protected.

I was thinking pools- I missed the hot tub.

I have never seen a hot tub that didn't require gfci as 680.42 reverts back to Part II. Part II is what I quoted...

680.42 (A)(2) states a gfci is required for cord and plug but that does not mean it is not required for the other. I think they don't want it plugged into any outlet but it is redundant iimo.

 

[VOICECOILS]

YES for california

YES for california

The answer is yes you need a GFCI protected hot tub especially outdoors. two pole 50 amp GFCI breakers are available as well as other amperages, Just remember you need a 3 wire cable to feed the GFCI disconnect. The Disconnect must be mounted within site and the distance that the NEC states.

 

[John120/240]

I have always used four wire to supply GFCI disconnects. Two hots, neutral, ground

 

[VOICECOILS]

I have always used four wire to supply GFCI disconnects. Two hots, neutral, ground

I see what you are saying. The ground is not counted. i.e. a single phase three wire service two hots and neutral and three phase 4 wire service three hots one neutral.

 

[jap]

I see what you are saying. The ground is not counted. i.e. a single phase three wire service two hots and neutral and three phase 4 wire service three hots one neutral.

So would you conside 12/2 and 12/2 w/ground both 2 wire cables?

 

[John120/240]

So would you conside 12/2 and 12/2 w/ground both 2 wire cables?

It is all about being understood or understanding the topic under discussion. It is a regional thing sometimes. I would call that 12-2-2

or 12-4. Mentioning the ground is not necessary. Example 8-2 Full size blk, wht, #10 ground. 8-3 Full size blk,red, wht.

8-3w/G Full size blk, red, wht, #10 ground.

 

[VOICECOILS]

So would you conside 12/2 and 12/2 w/ground both 2 wire cables?

yes. But not literally. Im talking about conductors. Ground is not counted as a conductor. The implication is how many conductors are listed on the material in question. i.e. 12/3 romex has three conductors, red, black and white with a bare ground. 12/4 MC or BX cable has Black, Red, Blue, white and a green ground.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Since 12/2 with ground is common we only ask for 12/2 nm- that's what they carry. We would have to order 12/2 without ground and nobody uses it except the central vac people that I know. so 12/2 is 2 wire cable with an equipment grounding conductor. This nomenclature changes when you get to rubber cord. Ask for 12/3 rubber cord and you will get a 2 wire cord with an equipment grounding conductor .

Of course you have to know what you suppliers call it. 12/2-2 is one cable with 2 white-one with a stripe- and 2 hot conductors and one equipment grounding conductor .