2017 NEC AFCI

[mbrooke]

not being sarcastic. So what. What is the relevance. The proposed code does not take into account the breakers already out in the field.

Just showing the CMP's train of thought. You are correct, this does take into account new breakers but not old ones, some which like FPE, Zinsco and Bulldog that do not even have magnetic trip.

Then there is the question "why did we have the branch circuit AFCI if these new breakers are just fine "

The new thermal mag breakers are only fine up to a certain point. Low POCO short circuit currents and lengths over 50 feet result in breakers which may not trip magnetically, hence why AFCIs were needed according to official docs.

In fact the original AFCI was supposed to be a regular breaker having a magnetic trip of only 75amps, but the idea was rejected due to nusinance tripping (ironically).

sorry don't buy it. Just furthers my opinion the afci is a mostly a fraud.

And, you are correct. Even though in theory the above is mostly correct (ohms law limits fault current) I still have to see a single shred of evidence which demonstrates a fault clearing an OCPD thermally leads to fire. To this day it still remains someone's word which has yet to be proven.

 

[flatlander]

Thanks for all that research. It's enlightening.

 

[mbrooke]

Thanks for all that research. It's enlightening.

Welcome


If you really want to know what they are calling an "arc fault" look at the history and evolution behind AFCIs. Its really eye opening

 

[mbrooke]

Thanks for all that research. It's enlightening.

And oh, my apologies, I left this out. :ashamed1: The patent to what I believe is the first AFCI along with a vid by the inventor explaining how short circuits lead to fires:




https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...DtRuasbQ_hYVrg&bvm=bv.110151844,d.cWw&cad=rja



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emxfsOUTkUg

 

[flatlander]

No need to apologize.

There is also the guy from Eaton, Engle I belive

 

[mbrooke]

No need to apologize.

There is also the guy from Eaton, Engle I belive

He is an interesting case. At first he was a major supporter of AFCIs and worked on developing them only to actually reverse his tone speaking out against them:

http://combinationafci.com/resources/doc_ieee_combination_afci.pdf

He also wrote proposals to the NFPA to mandate GFP in AFCIs, which coming from him gives you the idea GFP is actually worth something.

 

[bphgravity]

Learn More:

For more information about AFCI Circuit Breakers, please visit http://www.afcisafety.org

For more information about AFCI Outlet Branch Circuit Receptacles, please visit http://www.afcisafetyreceptacles.org

 

[mbrooke]

Learn More:

For more information about AFCI Circuit Breakers, please visit http://www.afcisafety.org

For more information about AFCI Outlet Branch Circuit Receptacles, please visit http://www.afcisafetyreceptacles.org

I have a vid you will truly enjoy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qCuXF9eDBM

However, even though this is at 240 volts nominal line to ground where arcing can be a legit concern under the right conditions, the arcing across the carbonized path is seen taking place between the live and EGC. An RCD (GFCI) will detect and stop such a condition without the need of complex, unproven, nuisance trip prone arc signature analysis. :thumbsup:

 

[peter d]

Learn More:

For more information about AFCI Circuit Breakers, please visit http://www.afcisafety.org

For more information about AFCI Outlet Branch Circuit Receptacles, please visit http://www.afcisafetyreceptacles.org

Do you really expect us skeptics to believe manufacturer driven propaganda? :happyno: