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Luminary cable without the MC

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    Luminary cable without the MC

    Sourcery LLC is a UL certified wire processing facility. I'm being asked to parallel power and control on a reel to be used as Luminary Cable that will be installed in conduit.

    10 THHN STR Black
    10 THHN STR Red
    10 THHN STR Green
    16 TFN Purple / Gray Twisted

    Will this meet code? We have many contractors asking for this product.

    Thank you.

    #2
    No. If I can't pull those conductors through conduit off separate reels, what makes you think putting them together on one reel and selling it to me makes it any different?

    Now, if you could come up with a product like luminary cable but without the armor and get it listed you would have something.

    -Hal

    Comment


      #3
      There is also an argument that if you put just the 16TFN twisted pair inside a jacket that would allow it to be used without a raceway as an NM family product, that can then be pulled into a raceway along with the individual THHN wires, making the result in conduit comparable in principle to luminary cable. But without a combined listing some (or most?) AHJs may not allow it.
      No doubt whatever in my mind that just pulling the combination into a raceway, regardless of how it was reeled, does not comply unless the control circuit can be (and is) reclassified to Class 1.
      If the reclassification can be done, then the bundle you would supply on one reel could be practical.

      Comment


        #4
        Is this product similar to [COLOR=#333333]Anixter’s Speepull or Quik-Pull? We use Quik-pull products quite often and custom order any configuration that we need.

        [/COLOR]https://www.anixter.com/en_us/servic...speedpull.html

        https://www.quik-pull.com/
        Rob

        Moderator

        All responses based on the 2017 NEC unless otherwise noted

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by infinity View Post
          Is this product similar to [COLOR=#333333]Anixter’s Speepull or Quik-Pull? We use Quik-pull products quite often and custom order any configuration that we need.[/COLOR]
          Sure, done that too. As long as you use all the conductors as allowed by Code. If you use a couple for a CL2 circuit that would be a violation.

          -Hal

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by GoldDigger View Post
            There is also an argument that if you put just the 16TFN twisted pair inside a jacket that would allow it to be used without a raceway as an NM family product, that can then be pulled into a raceway along with the individual THHN wires, making the result in conduit comparable in principle to luminary cable. But without a combined listing some (or most?) AHJs may not allow it.
            OP should look into that. Would be a moneymaker for sure.

            -Hal

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by onewaymj View Post
              Sourcery LLC is a UL certified wire processing facility. I'm being asked to parallel power and control on a reel to be used as Luminary Cable that will be installed in conduit.

              [COLOR="#FF0000"]10 THHN STR Black
              [COLOR="#FF0000"]10 THHN STR Red[/COLOR]
              [COLOR="#FF0000"]10 THHN STR Green[/COLOR][/COLOR]
              16 TFN Purple / Gray Twisted

              Will this meet code? We have many contractors asking for this product.

              Thank you.

              Not that it's a code thing, but, most LED fixtures with 0-10v dimming ballasts are 120v.

              Meaning a grounded conductor is required.

              Most times that would require a defined grounded conductor color such as white, gray.

              I'd be sure double check the color scheme with them before I produced too much of this awkward combination of colors.




              JAP>

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by jap View Post
                Not that it's a code thing, but, most LED fixtures with 0-10v dimming ballasts are 120v.
                Most are multi voltage compatible up to 277V, maybe more if they are sold in Canada.
                If Billy Idol is on your playlist go reevaluate your life.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by jap View Post
                  Not that it's a code thing, but, most LED fixtures with 0-10v dimming ballasts are 120v.

                  Meaning a grounded conductor is required.

                  Most times that would require a defined grounded conductor color such as white, gray.

                  I'd be sure double check the color scheme with them before I produced too much of this awkward combination of colors.


                  JAP>
                  I think the OP was just giving us an example of request he received from a contractor. Everything they do is custom and it's up to the customer as to how they use it.

                  -Hal

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by ActionDave View Post
                    Most are multi voltage compatible up to 277V, maybe more if they are sold in Canada.
                    Yes.

                    Just odd there wasn't a neutral color conductor mentioned.

                    Jap>

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by jap View Post
                      Yes.

                      Just odd there wasn't a neutral color conductor mentioned.

                      Jap>
                      Irrelevant to this discussion.

                      -Hal

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by jap View Post
                        Not that it's a code thing, but, most LED fixtures with 0-10v dimming ballasts are 120v.

                        Meaning a grounded conductor is required.

                        Most times that would require a defined grounded conductor color such as white, gray.

                        I'd be sure double check the color scheme with them before I produced too much of this awkward combination of colors.




                        JAP>
                        Originally posted by jap View Post
                        Yes.

                        Just odd there wasn't a neutral color conductor mentioned.

                        Jap>
                        I agree, whether it's a 120 or 277 volt system either one would require a neutral conductor so one conductor would need to identified as a neutral. It would be less likely that the circuits are 240 or 208 volts and not requiring a neutral.
                        Rob

                        Moderator

                        All responses based on the 2017 NEC unless otherwise noted

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by hbiss View Post
                          OP should look into that. Would be a moneymaker for sure.

                          -Hal


                          Irrellevant to the discussion.


                          JAP>

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by onewaymj View Post
                            Sourcery LLC is a UL certified wire processing facility. I'm being asked to parallel power and control on a reel to be used as Luminary Cable that will be installed in conduit.

                            10 THHN STR Black
                            10 THHN STR Red
                            10 THHN STR Green
                            16 TFN Purple / Gray Twisted

                            Will this meet code? We have many contractors asking for this product.

                            Thank you.
                            You mean TFFN like this:

                            https://www.mysouthwire.com/medias/s...4083469342.pdf

                            Sounds fine to me, except I would use 'TFFN' to keep everything 90C rated.
                            Comments based on 2017 NEC unless otherwise noted.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              NO!

                              -Hal

                              Comment

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