No announcement yet.

Frequently Asked 2005 NEC Questions

This topic is closed.
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    [LIST][*]Do you install three-ways and fourways so the load is off when the switches are all down?[/LIST]It is entirely a preference decision, just like whether grounds should be up or down.

    Here's some related threads, full of opinions:
    Last edited by Dennis Alwon; 09-05-11, 08:12 AM.


      [LIST][*]Should I join or avoid a Union shop?[/LIST]This topic is prohibited by policy. This topic brings out very passionate (and many times hurtful) responses from both Pro- and Non- Union individuals. It is a friendship-killing topic that will be stopped in it's tracks as soon as it is reported to and/or seen by a moderator.

      If you are curious about why you should join or avoid a union, feel free to Private Message individuals about the topic. Union members are not prohibited from mentioning their affiliation in their signatures, and many do. They can be located and contacted with minimal difficulty.

      If you would like to be added to this list as an advocate for either merit or union employment, feel free to PM me. Being added to the list on this post means that you would be willing to recieve PM's from members wishing to discuss this issue privately.*

      *All members should bear in mind that the same rules of conduct apply to private messages as well as public posts, but are not visible to moderators. Anyone who would use this list as a means to harass or otherwise offend those members who've chosen to be a part of this list, will be subject to immediate suspension of their membership from this forum.


      Last edited by George Stolz; 07-30-07, 09:17 PM.


        UL White Book

        The UL White Book is a profoundly helpful publication by the Underwriters Laboratories that works hand-in-hand with the NEC (in most cases). Many times, there is a practice or use for a listed item that is not mentioned in the NEC, and can be cleared up by looking at how the item was listed.

        The UL White Book can be searched online by clicking here for the many-optioned search page or here for the shorter search page.
        The entire 2006 UL White Book can be downloaded immediately in .pdf format by clicking on this link: Large download of White Book.

        One easy way to search for the information you're looking for on the many-optioned search page is to search for not only the device type, but also a manufacturer in the same search.

        For example, I'm mostly familiar with Cooper receptacles. If I want to know the listing requirements for receptacles in general, it's still helpful to add the name of a manufacturer I am familiar with, to get more closely related hits.

        Bear in mind, the UL is not the only NRTL around, but they are the most easily recognized.

        Related Links:
        Cool Feature of the UL White Book - Nov 2006. Started by Pierre, with 7 replies
        Last edited by Dennis Alwon; 09-05-11, 08:12 AM.



          Much of what is posted here is taken from this source. I have taken the liberty of bolding my personal favorites.

          Certain rules of unspoken etiquette are recommended to be followed when using Internet forums. They include:[LIST][*]One should read all the rules and guidelines established by the community; some communities may have different regulations on a particular subject.[*]One should always be courteous.[*]Before creating a new topic thread, one is advised to search to see if a similar topic already exists.[*]Contributors should follow standard grammar and spelling rules and avoid slang.[*]If the forum is categorized, one should strive to post in the correct section.[*]When making a technical inquiry, one should include as much technical information as possible, especially in the subject line.[*]Contributors are asked to stay on-topic.[*]Contributors should avoid double posting and Crossposting.[*]To avoid appearing self-absorbed, one should respond to topics started by others more often than starting topics of their own.[*]Contributors should avoid the use of all CAPITAL LETTERS in posts. All CAPS is considered "shouting" and causes readability issues.[*]One is advised not to resurrect a very old topic if nothing significant will be added. This practice is known as revival or Necroing.[*]One should try to refrain from lashing back at a poorly behaving member or participating in a flame war; instead, notify the messageboard's staff of the event.[*]When quoting a previous post, one should only include the relevant portion of that post. Contributors are requested to keep in mind that their audience can likely still see the message they are quoting on the same screen and can read it again if need be. Click here to see detailed instructions on how to do this effectively.[*]Try not to edit a post after other members have already replied to your original. If you forgot to mention an important detail in your original post, simply post another reply in the thread with the follow-up information. It can be very confusing for other members who are unaware of the edit.[*]Try to avoid cursing. This site consists of probably 50% construction workers, who are reknowned for their ability to curse. Cursing does not add to a post, and the non-construction workers probably find it offensive. One aspect of this site that makes it special is that people from all walks contribute here, and cursing can turn people off from the site, whose contributions we value greatly. We don't need professionals getting turned off and leaving due to rampant cussing. A guideline I use is when I would normally say "p***ed", I simply switch it to "ticked", it works just as well.[*]Avoid bathroom humor and sexual innuendo. It will be deleted. People come here for help with technical issues, to advance their knowledge of products and theory, and to talk shop. This site is restricted to electrical professionals only, which makes this site somewhat unique, so try to act professional. Humor definutely adds to the mix here, it's half the reason to be here: but it does not need to be dirty to be funny.[*]Try to split your posts into paragraphs. They're easier to read. Admittedly, some of us type a sentence a paragraph, which is a touch excessive - but it beats giving headaches to the reader by packing a lot of information into a solid block of text. It also encourages people quoting your post to take the single small paragraph they are really focused on.[/LIST]
          Last edited by George Stolz; 02-17-07, 08:51 AM.


            Etiquette II / Quoting Primer

            Sometimes, when posting a response to a particular post, you really are replying to the post in it's entirety. In that case, it's more appropriate to simply set your reply up as you would type a letter, and simply say the person's name at the beginning of the reply:

            Fred, I disagree with your post. Grass is definutely green.
            instead of

            Originally posted by fred
            Grass can be blue, orange or any other color. Look at these pictures of grass I have doctored with photoshop:
            Obviously, some doctoring was necessary in order to convey the point I am trying to get across, which is that I'm unwilling to admit that I'm wrong and crow is poisonous to me. In general, George is just typing to make this fake post seem longer and more complicated, which is difficult considering the generic topic he has chosen. In fact, he probably would have been better served to have selected a couple of real examples of each method of posting, and saved himself some trouble. But, after all, why stop while you're having fun, right? And besides, it would look like I was singling somebody out for doing this, right? Grass can definutely be purple.

            Deal with it.
            I disagree, grass is definutely green.
            This is especially helpful when the quoted post has several large pictures in it. There is very little point in reposting the pictures in the quote. If a particular picture is important to your reply, then simply say "the third picture" for example, it's much kinder to the reader.

            [COLOR=black]Are you not sure how to single out a single sentence of a post to quote? Here's a primer. Let's look at the quote above, the long one. I want to expose Fred for the photo-doctoring yutz he is.[/COLOR]

            [COLOR=black]I hit the "quote" button in Fred's post, and see the following in the message window:[/COLOR]

            [COLOR=black]It's really the first sentence that proves Fred is a photoshopping SOB. So, click and drag, highlighting everything from the end of the post backward:[/COLOR]

            [COLOR=black]Now, you hit delete. But, computers being computers, something broke:[/COLOR]

            [COLOR=black]The [/quote] tag on the end accidentally got half-deleted, because Windows machines like being overly helpful and highlighting words instead of letters the way they should. Your computer is deciding for you that the [/ at the end of what you deleted is part of the last word you actually wanted deleted. So, you have to type it back into the end of the quoted post for it to look right.[/COLOR]

            Then just type in your reply.

            [COLOR=black]The finished post looks like this:[/COLOR]

            [COLOR=black]The extra effort makes your posts easier to read.[/COLOR][COLOR=black] Sometimes, it's hard to understand where 'what's quoted' ends, and where the reply begins. Feel free to PM me if this doesn't help and you'd like more help figuring this out, many folks already have and are happier with their experience here.[/COLOR]

            If you want to practice, feel free to put practice posts up on this thread.

            If you want to learn how to do a quote within a quote, or multiple quotes from different people in the same reply, click here.
            Last edited by George Stolz; 06-24-07, 08:56 AM.


              Grounding Vs. Bonding
              The Big Picture
              [LIST][*]connecting electrical devices together in the attempt to trip a breaker, if an ungrounded conductor touches surface metal associated with the system.

              What does the earth have to do with this? Nothing.

              Electricity does not seek the path of least resistance to the earth. It seeks all available pathssourcenot the destination for the electricity.

              Driving a ground rod, or using a Ufer, or a metal water pipe is not a substitute for an EGC. A ground rod with 25 ohms to earth will allow almost five amps to escape the system into the earth when directly energized from a 120V source. Five amps will never trip a 15A or 20A breaker, and in the meantime everything bonded to this ground rod will be energized to 120V.

              Bob Ludecke has created a powerpoint presentation under the 2002 cycle, and has granted permission for a link to be posted for download. Chris Knight has graciously provided a site for downloading the presentation:

              Thanks to both Chris and Bob for their help on this very important topic!

              If any of the items discussed here does not make sense to you, or if you disagree, please start a thread publicly or send a private message to me to discuss it privately, if you desire. It is critical that this issue be understood to ensure the safety of everyone involved.
              Last edited by George Stolz; 09-06-09, 11:30 PM.


                [LIST][*]Is the neutral a current carrying conductor? How do I apply 310.15(B)(4)?[/LIST]First the silly answer: the neutral always carries current.

                310.15(B)(4) tells us that we don't need to account for neutral conductors that only carry 'the unbalanced current from other conductors of the same circuit'. These conductors still carry some current, but we are permitted to ignore them in our accounting when applying the adjustment factors of table 310.15(B)(2)(a).

                This is found in two common situations.

                1) A single phase feeder or multi-wire branch circuit consisting of two 'hots' (ungrounded conductors) and a single 'neutral' (grounded conductor). In this case, the neutral carries only the unbalanced current of the two hot conductors, we would count a total of two current carrying conductors.

                2) A three phase feeder or multi-wire branch circuit consisting of three 'hots' (ungrounded conductors) and a single 'neutral' (grounded conductor) where the major portion of the load is linear. In this case, the neutral carries only the unbalanced current of the three hot conductors, we would count a total of three current carrying conductors.

                The rest of the time we have to count the neutral.

                To understand this, remember that 310.15(B)(4) is all about accounting, not about reality. This is about figuring out the correct number from 310.15(B)(2)(a) to apply, not about the minute details of how many conductors actually have a bit of current flowing on them.

                The main requirement is that the conductor carry only the unbalanced current of the other conductors in the same circuit. This tells us that there have to be other conductors, and that these other conductors have to be able to carry the _balanced_ current of the circuit. If the other conductors can possibly carry all of the balanced current, then only the unbalanced current is left for the neutral. This is the case when 310.15(B)(4) kicks in. The neutral may carry some current, but it doesn't count for 310.15(B)(2)(a).

                But if the 'hot' conductors are not balanced, then some of the balanced current must flow on the neutral. This this case with any single 'line-neutral' circuit, and is also the case when you have two phases of a three phase wye system sharing a neutral. The neutral carries both unbalanced and balanced current, and must be counted for 310.15(B)(2)(a).

                Harmonics confuse this a bit: the neutral has to carry the _balanced_ triplen harmonic current of the load. We are permitted some leeway, but when the major portion of the load is non-linear, the neutral is no longer considered to carry _only_ unbalanced current from the other conductors, and thus must be counted.


                Related Threads:
                Origination thread of this FAQ - Mar 2008. Started by Winnie, with 9 replies as of 3/14/07.
                Good Examples of when the neutral is a current carrying conductor
                [COLOR=silver]Edit to remove opening conversational remark, edit format[/COLOR]
                [COLOR=silver]Edit to add related thread[/COLOR]
                Last edited by Dennis Alwon; 09-05-11, 08:59 PM.


                  Noteworthy Links

                  EC&M: Tables, Examples, and Appendices - Chapter 9, Appendix B - Article written for EC&M by Fredric P. Hartwell (12/1995). (Link Ctsy of Celtic)

                  EC&M: The Middle Of The Wire Isn't It's End - Article written for EC&M by Fredric P. Hartwell (03/1998). Details the use of the 60 and 75 degree columns when determining ampacity. (Link Ctsy of Celtic)
                  Handicap Accessibility requirements for receptacles and switches - Short thread about heights and ADA.
                  Charlie's Rule of Technical Reading - The NEC comes alive when read using Charlie's Rule.
                  NEMA Guide to Water-Damaged Equipment, and an NEC Digest article on water-damaged equipment by Jim Pauley of Square D.
                  The dangers of open neutrals - Article by Mike Holt.
                  480Sparky's open neutral powerpoint presentation.
                  Online Pulling Calculator at Link csty of Don Ganiere.
                  Bussman Short Circuit Calc PDF
                  High Voltage Shock Presentation - Link csty of Larry Fine.
                  Receptacle Heights for ADA (Disability Requirements)
                  Business 101 - tx2step makes a record-breaking post about business.
                  1901 NEC - Download location found by Bryan Holland.
                  Fluorescent Socket PDF - Describes the differences in sockets for different ballasts. Link Ctsy of Bob Badger.
                  Why does 240.4(D) exist? - Good thread by KingPB, link to answer.
                  480Sparky's Linkfest - 480Sparky started a thread for posting more links to good information.
                  Ronald Coleman's page - Internet Index of interest for electricians.
         - link ctsy of emahler.
                  How to attach an Excel spreadsheet to a post
                  Drilling Glulams
                  Last edited by Dennis Alwon; 09-02-11, 02:42 PM.


                    [LIST][*]Am I required to bond the hot and cold supply pipes to the motor of a jetted tub?[/LIST]*Note: There is some disagreement as to the interpretation of NEC-2005 680.74.

                    IMO, No. Check out 680.74:

                    680.74 Bonding. All metal piping systems and all grounded metal parts in contact with the circulating water shall be bonded together using a copper bonding jumper, insulated, covered, or bare, not smaller than 8 AWG solid.
                    Only the piping systems in contact with the circulating water are required to be bonded. Generally, these are plastic (supplied with the tub) so no bonding is required by the NEC.

                    This was an intentional lowering of the requirements in the 2005 cycle.

                    Panel Statement: The need for bonding in a bathroom differs from the need for bonding in a pool area. Electrical equipment of a hydromassage bathtub is not accessible to users of the tub. Only parts that can cause a voltage gradient in the bathtub need to be bonded. Section 680.74 has been concisely reworded to require the bonding of only the parts that present a risk of creating voltage gradients in the hydromassage bathtub. The panel's action on 17-183 supersedes the panel's action on ROP 17-153.
                    Related Threads:
                    Another jacuzzi tub bonding question?? - May 2007. Started by Jango, still in progress.
                    Whirlpool Tub Bond Lug - May 2007. Started by gaelectric, 50 replies, still in progress.
                    Hydromassage Tub Code References Please - Apr 2007. Started by Vinniem, 22 replies.
                    Poll for Inspectors - Mar 2007. Started by JlJohnson, 45 replies.
                    Hydro Tub Bonding - Sep 2007. Started by Dirkhats, 17 replies to date.
                    Last edited by George Stolz; 09-25-07, 11:44 PM.


                      Quote within a Quote, Multiple Quotes

                      Quoting Guide II
                      Multiple Quotes

                      If you would like to quote several posts in one reply, here's how to do it:

                      Stan says that GFCI's are not required in kitchens in post #2.

                      Fred says that receptacles in a kitchen are required to be no more than two feet apart in post #4.

                      1. Click on the Click image for larger version

Name:	multiquote_40b.png
Views:	1
Size:	2.7 KB
ID:	2367119 button in either post - let's say I hit the quote button in Stan's post. The reply screen loads, with Stan's quote in quote bars, as described in the quoting guide. Erase the parts you don't wish to reply to, to save space and to clarify what you're responding to.

                      2. Type your reply to Stan's comment. Hit the enter key a couple times, when you're finished, to make a little space for the next quote.

                      3. Type in the first quote bracket, [quote=Fred] , and scroll down the reply screen until you see Fred's comment. (If you leave out the [COLOR=darkslateblue]=Fred[/COLOR] part of the quote bracket, the quote will still work - but everyone will think Stan said what's in the quote, since he was the last one you quoted. The software automatically put a [COLOR=navy]=Stan[/COLOR] into the first quote when you hit the button in Stan's post.)

                      If a thread is more than 10 replies long, you will have to click the link at the bottom of the displayed posts to open the thread back up in a new window, to find Fred's earlier comment.

                      4. Copy Fred's comment, and paste it into the reply screen.

                      5. Type the end quote bracket, [/quote] .

                      6. Hit the return key a couple times, and reply to Fred.

                      7. Hit the preview post button, to make sure it went off as you intended.

                      So this:
                      [quote=Stan]GFCI's are not required in kitchens.[/quote]

                      Stan, you need to read 210.8 - GFCI's are required on countertops.

                      [quote=Fred]Receptacles in a kitchen are required to be no more than two feet apart.[/quote]

                      They can be four feet apart.


                      Looks like this:


                      Originally posted by Stan
                      GFCI's are not required in kitchens.
                      Stan, you need to read 210.8 - GFCI's are required on countertops.

                      Originally posted by Fred
                      Receptacles in a kitchen are required to be no more than two feet apart.
                      They can be four feet apart.


                      Quote within a quote

                      Scenario: Stan said no GFCI's in a kitchen, and Fred replied with a correction with no code reference, and you want to be fancy and show them both and add the code reference. Here's how:


                      Originally posted by Fred
                      Originally posted by Stan
                      No GFCI's required in a kitchen.
                      Not true, but I don't have my code book handy.

                      [/quote] <----------(Ignore this: when the software gets a lot of bracketing going on, it starts adding gunk, it's a glitch.)

                      Take a look at 210.8.


                      [quote=Fred][quote=Stan]No GFCI's required in a kitchen.[/quote]
                      [left]Not true, but I don't have my code book handy.[/quote][/quote][/left]

                      Take a look at 210.8.
                      Last edited by Dennis Alwon; 09-01-11, 08:00 PM.


                        [list]Is pretwisting conductors required when using wirenuts?[/list]

                        This question is not answered in the NEC, it is a product listing question. Products are required to be used in accordance with their listing by 110.3(B).

                        Most (if not all) wirenuts are listed for use as follows: Pretwisting the conductors is not necessary, but not prohibited - as long as the conductors are twisted once the wirenut is in place, then the manufacturer's instructions have been followed and the code is satisfied. If the connection is not twisted, then there is a 110.3(B) violation when using most (if not all) brands of wirenuts.

                        That said, most electricians will agree that a pretwisted connection is the most professional method, as it allows the installer to see without a doubt that the connection is tight before installing the wirenut.

                        But pre-twisters and post-twisters are all welcome here.


                          [LIST][*]Does a receptacle behind a fridge need to be a single receptacle?[/LIST]This question has many different codes that inspire it, and they all address different aspects:[LIST=1][*]210.52(B)(1) & (2) - If a duplex is installed, what's the other receptacle doing, if it's on the Small Appliance Branch Circuit (SABC)? Isn't this second receptacle behind the fridge prohibited?[*]210.52(B)(1), exception 2 - If a duplex receptacle is installed, isn't this no longer an 'individual branch circuit', since there are two receptacles and one appliance?[*]210.8(A)(6) - If the receptacle for the fridge is right next to the counter, and easily used from the countertop, does it need to be a single receptacle or GFCI protected?[*]210.8(A)(7) - If the receptacle for the fridge is within 6' of a wet-bar sink, wouldn't it need to be a single receptacle or be GFCI protected?[/LIST]I'll just take each as I've laid them out:[LIST=1][*]210.52(B)(1) requires the receptacle outlets for walls, counters and refrigerators to be supplied from the SABCs. A receptacle outlet is an outlet box containing one or more receptacles; a duplex receptacle in an outlet box behind the fridge meets this requirement.[*]No: an individual branch circuit supplies only one appliance by the definition in Article 100. The definition does not discuss the number of receptacles supplied by the circuit, but the loads; therefore, a receptacle outlet supplying one appliance is an individual branch circuit.[*]No: A receptacle has to be installed over the countertop to serve the countertop (210.52(C)(5)). If it is installed behind the fridge, to serve the fridge, then 210.8(A)(6) does not apply to it. Further, there are no exceptions to 210.8(A)(6), all receptacles installed to serve the countertop are to be GFCI protected. Installing a single receptacle for a single appliance does not matter, as it does in basements and garages.[*]GFCI protection would be required whether the receptacle is a single or a duplex, as there are no exceptions for laundry, utility, and wet bar sinks as there are for basements and garages. Please note that a kitchen sink is not a wet bar sink by common interpretation, but wet bar sinks (or kitchen sinks) are not defined in the NEC. A refrigerator receptacle 1' from a sink in a kitchen does not require GFCI protection, but the same situation at a wet bar does.[/LIST]Don't ask me to make sense of it, I'm just repeating what I believe.


                            [LIST][*]Is sharing neutrals an acceptable practice? Is it code compliant?[/LIST]Sharing neutrals is perfectly legal in most situations. The NEC term for several ungrounded conductors sharing a neutral is a "multiwire branch circuit." The definition is in Article 100. The key is, a multiwire branch circuit has a voltage between all the conductors of the circuit - two conductors on the "A" phase is not a multiwire branch circuit.

                            So, code compliance aside, is it a good idea? Many electricians do not approve of them, as disconnecting a neutral when one or more of the ungrounded conductors are live results in damage to equipment, and a shock hazard to the person working on the circuit.

                            The portion of the neutral that is connected to energized loads is carrying current, and can be lethal.

                            That said, 70% of members polled (here) use multiwire branch circuits (MWBCs), and proudly so. They are more efficient in terms of voltage drop, and in material used. Simply put, using one neutral for three line-to-neutral circuits in a commercial setting saves 66% of conductor over using dedicated grounded conductors for each circuit.

                            As for the potential for shock hazard, electricians need to be aware of the wiring method and disconnect and lock out all ungrounded conductors supplying a MWBC - just as they would if it were a simple two-wire circuit.

                            In the 2008 cycle, it appears that all handles supplying MWBCs will have to be tied together to prevent this hazard. Opinions abound about their use, but one thing is for certain; MWBCs continue to be used, and everyone should be aware of their benefits and drawbacks, for the safety of both the electrician and the equipment of the user.

                            Be sure to check out some applicable sections: 210.4, 501.40, 502.40, 505.21.

                            Related links:
                            Inspecting MWBC's in the panel, Aug 2007. Started by Dan Smith, Discusses the new requirements on MWBC's coming up in the 2008, and a discussion about the pros and cons of MWBCs ensued.
                            Last edited by George Stolz; 09-04-07, 08:26 PM.


                              [LIST][*]Are anti-shorts (redheads) required for MC cable?[/LIST]

                              Not for MC.

                              NEMA has an engineering bulletin that explains that bushings are not required with MC.

                              Here it is, the original can be found on the web.

                              ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT
                              No. 90

                              August 14, 2002

                              Use of Anti-Short Bushings for Terminating Type MC Cable
                              There has been much confusion within the Installation and Inspection communities regarding the
                              use of anti-short bushings for terminating Type MC cable. The confusion stems from the fact
                              that some MC cable manufacturers include anti-short bushings with their cable. The inclusion of
                              anti-short bushings with coils or reels of MC cable is based on historical practice relating to the
                              requirements of 320.40 of the NEC, which mandates the use of anti-short bushing or its
                              equivalent protection for Type AC Cable
                              Fittings used with Type MC Cable are required to be listed per 330.40 of the NEC. NEMA
                              supports the use of listed fittings for MC Cable. The design of these fittings may or may not
                              include an insulated throat however, they are required to be provided with a smooth, rounded end
                              stop so that the metal sheath of the cable will not pass through and the wires will not be damaged
                              in passing over the end stop. Whether or not an insulated throat is part of the listed product, these
                              listed MC fittings do not require an additional anti-short bushing. Anti-short bushings that may
                              be supplied by MC Cable manufacturers are for optional use by the installer, however they are
                              not required.

                              ROP #7-116 from the May 2001 Report on Proposals (ROP) for the 2002 NEC was a proposal
                              seeking to require anti-short bushings on all MC Cable termination installations.
                              The following is an excerpt from the Panel statement rejecting the proposal:

                              Anti-short bushings are not required for Type MC cable in accordance with the listing for
                              the product. The termination fittings approved for use with Type MC cables are designed
                              such that the wires will not come in contact with the cut edge of the armor; the throat of
                              the fitting is small enough to prevent contact with the armor. Type MC termination
                              fittings perform the same function for Type MC cable as Type AC terminations plus the
                              anti-short bushing do for Type AC cable.

                              NEMA supports the uniform adoption and enforcement of the NEC and recommends that local
                              Authorities Having Jurisdiction follow the requirements of NEC Section 330.40, Boxes and
                              Fittings for MC Cable. Section 330.40 requires that the fitting be listed, but does not mandate the
                              use of an anti-short bushing.

                              Distribution List:

                              Standards and Conformity Assessment Policy Committee
                              Codes and Standards Committee
                              NEMA Executive Staff
                              [COLOR=SlateGray]Edit for formatting[COLOR=Black][/COLOR][/COLOR]
                              Last edited by George Stolz; 10-03-07, 06:18 PM.


                                [LIST][*]How do you insert a picture in the body of your message?[/LIST]
                                [COLOR=SeaGreen]In order to post (insert) photos and images on this forum, the image must have a URL address. Something like htty://www.hereiswheremyphotoisstored.jpg. You must have this URL address in order to insert a photo.

                                How to post photos:

                                1. Open an account at Photobucket. It’s free.
                                Upload your images there.

                                2. Remember that the larger the image size, the longer it takes to upload and download. Keep that in mind, especially for our users that have dial-up internet service. If need be, please resize your photos before uploading them.

                                3. When you want to post an image, find the image in your Photobucket list, and there will be four lines underneath it. For this example, I'll use an image I have of a 1953 NEC The second line will be titled “Direct Link”, and will have the URL address for that image. Highlight that line, then Copy (Ctrl-C) the information.

                                4. Now go to the thread you wish to post a photo in, and begin your response. When you get to where you want to insert an image, click on the yellow icon with the mountain & sun (that is supposed to be a ‘photo’).

                                5. A small window will appear, asking you for the URL of the image.

                                Paste (Ctrl-V) the information you copied earlier into the line. The URL address will then appear. Click OK.

                                6. Now your response will look like this: Do not worry that you can’t see the image. The commands needed by the forums software will take care of that for you.


                                This is what you'll see:

                                Note: You are only allowed to post eight images, by the forum software. This includes the smiley faces seen to the right of the reply screen.

                                Originally posted by mdshunk
                                Before you upload them into your PhotoBucket album, click the 'options' thing I have pointed to here, and pick a size. 640x480 is nice for forums, or you can go smaller. It will automatically resize your stuff to that size when you upload each time.

                                Edit formatting (intro question)
                                Edit to add Note at bottom.
                                Edit to add Marc's note, per Ken's request.
                                Last edited by iwire; 07-11-09, 09:54 AM. Reason: Fix broken link