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Are rubber gloves required for using a voltmeter on an open 240V panelboard?

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    Are rubber gloves required for using a voltmeter on an open 240V panelboard?

    Are rubber gloves required when using a clamp meter or voltmeter on open panelboards with voltage that is 240V or less? I'm an EE and, as I've been learning about electrical safety, I believe they are required, but I've never seen the electricians I work with wear them.

    #2
    Is this a facility subject to OSHA regulation? If so, the standards adopted to comply with OSHA should answer this question.

    Comment


      #3
      This should start something...

      https://www.depts.ttu.edu/opmanual/OP60.14B.pdf

      here is more
      http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/...00_ENG_A_W.PDF

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Calrissian45 View Post
        Are rubber gloves required when using a clamp meter or voltmeter on open panelboards with voltage that is 240V or less? I'm an EE and, as I've been learning about electrical safety, I believe they are required, but I've never seen the electricians I work with wear them.
        Doesn't matter where this occurs. Unqualified persons, including engineers touching energized equipment, are required to down full flash gear with moon suit, face mask, & rubber gloves, tested & certified for the voltage level.

        Qualified persons can do it naked.
        Roger Ramjet NoFixNoPay

        Comment


          #5
          Recommend getting a copy of NFPA 70. Read Article 130. Without seeing the area arc-flash assessment, I'd say you are looking at PPE Category 1
          Standard work apparel:
          Arc-Rated clothing, 4cal/cm^2
          Hard hat
          Safety Glasses

          Arc-Rated face shield
          hearing protection
          Leather Gloves
          Optional: rubber gloves and leather protectors

          You are correct, for 240V and below, some electricians won't use anything other than their normal FRs, a hardhat, and safety glasses. Of course, unless the panel/transformer are something strange, the SCC is rarely more than a few thousand Amps. And they know that.

          Recommend to take an NFPA 70E class. Interview the instructors. Some (most?) are terrible. Too many show endless pictures of burned up electricians. Yeah, we got that - it's dangerous. What we want to know is: How do we mitigate the risk? Your class is not helping.

          Get the company to pony up for the electricians to take the same class.
          Without data you’re just another person with an opinion – Edwards Deming

          Comment


            #6
            Arc flash isn’t the question it’s shock. Shock fatalities are vastly greater than arc flash. Rubber gloves are required where you do not use insulated tools. See IEEE 519 which is what 70E is based on. There are three work methods. The third one is bare hands live line that is impractical at 240 V. Even 70E is confused on gloves since they recommend clean dry leather gloves for using 240 V plugs.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by paulengr View Post
              ... they recommend clean dry leather gloves ...
              I've never found this satisfactory. Leather is skin, after all. "Clean", on a jobsite, is somewhere between temporary, unattainable and ludicrous. Likewise "dry": You sweat in the summer and it rains & snows in the winter.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by paulengr View Post
                Arc flash isn’t the question it’s shock. Shock fatalities are vastly greater than arc flash. Rubber gloves are required where you do not use insulated tools. See IEEE 519 which is what 70E is based on. There are three work methods. The third one is bare hands live line that is impractical at 240 V. Even 70E is confused on gloves since they recommend clean dry leather gloves for using 240 V plugs.
                IEEE Std 519™-2014

                IEEE Recommended Practice and
                Requirements for Harmonic Control in
                Electric Power Systems

                Must be a mis-type. Where should I be looking?

                Q2: Can you give a reference on where the confusion is about gloves and 240V plugs? I'm not finding it.


                Without data you’re just another person with an opinion – Edwards Deming

                Comment


                  #9
                  2018 NFPA 70E, Table 130.4.D.a, Restricted Approach Boundary, 50V - 300V, "Avoid Contact"

                  2018 NFPA 70E, 130.4.F.1 (and .2) Restricted Approach Boundary
                  Yes, I would translate that rubber gloves OR insulated tools are satisfactory.
                  Without data you’re just another person with an opinion – Edwards Deming

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by ramsy View Post

                    Doesn't matter where this occurs. Unqualified persons, including engineers touching energized equipment, are required to down full flash gear with moon suit, face mask, & rubber gloves, tested & certified for the voltage level.

                    Qualified persons can do it naked.
                    Ramsy - naked
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                    Okay - I had to bleach my brain and my eyeballs
                    I'm back now
                    Without data you’re just another person with an opinion – Edwards Deming

                    Comment


                      #11

                      IEEE 516. IEEE Guide for Maintenance Methods on Energized Power Lines

                      I know it sounds like it’s for utilities but OSHA and 70E refer to the same one.


                      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by paulengr View Post
                        IEEE 516. IEEE Guide for Maintenance Methods on Energized Power Lines

                        I know it sounds like it’s for utilities but OSHA and 70E refer to the same one.


                        Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                        That’s for high voltages. Like you stated, it’s for energized power lines. In the 50’s line voltages were getting above 300kV. Guys were still using wood poles for live line work or building redundant lines to work on them dead.
                        They started a guide in the 70’s. That guide wasn’t published as a standard until the late 80’s.

                        ahyhoo... the op is talking about 240V and below....

                        Comment


                          #13
                          It depends on what if any rules you are required to follow.

                          70E is kind of a default that is referred to if nothing else applies. OSHA applies to employees, if you are a one man show, there is only whatever rules you decide to follow. That don't mean you won't be required to comply with on site standards by owners/operators/GC's on some jobs though.
                          I live for today, I'm just a day behind.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Sorry for the very tardy response; SEE California Title 8 Paragraph 2320.2: https://www.dir.ca.gov/Title8/2320_2.html
                            [COLOR=black]"Bob"[/COLOR]
                            Robert B. Alexander, P.E.
                            Answers based on 2017 NEC unless otherwise noted.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by iceworm View Post

                              Ramsy - naked
                              .
                              Okay - I had to bleach my brain and my eyeballs
                              I'm back now
                              Originally posted by rbalex View Post
                              ..SEE California Title 8 Paragraph 2320.2: https://www.dir.ca.gov/Title8/2320_2.html
                              After reading Bob's post, I see there's no excuse for exposing naked digits.
                              Roger Ramjet NoFixNoPay

                              Comment

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