Asbestos

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Microwatt

Senior Member
Location
North Dakota
This is related to the electrical industry in a round about way. Anyone work much in suspended ceilings with ACM installed on the beams as fire proofing? I encounter it on a daily basis but I can't seem to find anyone, around here anyway, that can give me some good information on the hazards and I am a little confused on when it's hazardous and when it is not.:-?
 

peter

Senior Member
Location
San Diego
I don't know what "ACM" is but if it were installed within the last few years, I doubt if it contains any asbestos. When was the building built?

97% of the asbestos is of a curly type [like pubic hairs]. The other type is shaped like needles. The needle type is the type which is dangerous. The curly type is not so much dangerous. But it is easier to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

~Peter
 

cowboyjwc

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Simi Valley, CA
I would have to agree with Peter.

If you've been in the trades for any length of time, you would be surprised at how often you probably encountered asbestos and didn't know it.
 

nhfire77

Senior Member
Location
NH
I don't know what "ACM" is but if it were installed within the last few years, I doubt if it contains any asbestos. When was the building built?

97% of the asbestos is of a curly type [like pubic hairs]. The other type is shaped like needles. The needle type is the type which is dangerous. The curly type is not so much dangerous. But it is easier to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

~Peter

Asbestos Containing Material
 

nhfire77

Senior Member
Location
NH
IN general, if you have to disturb the ACM, you have to build a containment area and have a negative pressure vent etc..

If you or your equipment does not touch it, in any way, nothing special. Just don't touch it.

I am sure there are more specific rules

On a lighter note, asbestos can be eaten with no ill effects. It is only dangerous if inhaled. Please don't try this, its too dry anyway :)
 
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USMC1302

Senior Member
Location
NW Indiana
Not all fireproofing contains asbestos, so before getting excited be sure the material in question is ACM. Unless someone knows differently, you cannot tell ACM by looking at it, it has to be tested. If the material is in good condition, undisturbed and you will not cause it to become "friable", or airborne particulate by drilling, sanding, etc. not a problem. If your work would cause an issue, I would not continue until the problem is mitigated. AHERA and other regulations require management plans and recordkeeping for areas containing ACM. It is a hazard that I'm sure everyone here has been exposed to at some point. Floor tile and mastic, plaster, brake pads, pipe insulation. Common sense in working around it goes a long way
 

quogueelectric

Senior Member
Location
new york
I dont aprove of this as an instruction manual however when dry asbestos becomes airborne you need a mask capable of traping said fibers. To keep it from getting airborne use water ie a spray bottle to keep it wet and from getting airborne and into your lungs. The openings in a dust mask are 100 times larger than the fibers you are trying to trap why bother wearing it unless you use the purple cartridge. It doesnt help at all.
 

Microwatt

Senior Member
Location
North Dakota
I don't know what "ACM" is but if it were installed within the last few years, I doubt if it contains any asbestos. When was the building built?

97% of the asbestos is of a curly type [like pubic hairs]. The other type is shaped like needles. The needle type is the type which is dangerous. The curly type is not so much dangerous. But it is easier to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

~Peter

ACM = asbestos containing materials

The original part of the building was built in 1908 and there have been quite a few additions. They have fairly good info on which areas do contain asbestos, but we have discovered they aren't completely correct and it is the needle type you speak of.
 

USMC1302

Senior Member
Location
NW Indiana
The building owner should be responsible for having it tested. If you're working around friable material, you should be wearing proper PPE of at least a respirator IMO
 

Microwatt

Senior Member
Location
North Dakota
IN general, if you have to disturb the ACM, you have to build a containment area and have a negative pressure vent etc..

If you or your equipment does not touch it, in any way, nothing special. Just don't touch it.

I am sure there are more specific rules

On a lighter note, asbestos can be eaten with no ill effects. It is only dangerous if inhaled. Please don't try this, its too dry anyway :)

Here's my biggest question. If we enter a ceiling tile with know ACM as fire proofing above it we can only enter that tile if we are in a containment unit of some type. We typically use mobile personal containment units. They are basicly a rooling set of stairs wrapped in vinyl with a HEPA vac for neg air. We also wear a ty-vec suits and a mask.

Here is what I don't understand. There are parts of the facility with plenum ceilings. Those ceilings contain the same fire proofing. You can literally look up through return air grates a see it. Also, there is an electrical room with no suspended ceiling and the same fire proofing. You can tell it has been scrapped off in the past and I'm sure it's covering all of the equipment in the room. Neither of these seem to be a big deal around here. What's the deal?

It really doesn't take much to disturb it. There are areas they thought were clean until we asked them to test it. Tests were positive. They called it "inadvertant migration" from other areas.

I've heard different adout eating it. It can stick in your stomach the same as it can stick in your lungs.
 

dmagyar

Senior Member
Location
Rocklin, Ca.
"Us" vs "them"

"Us" vs "them"

Doesn't sound like a great situation, but who knows what else is "around" the corner regarding something we use today but tomorrow is "bad". I don't want to make lite of what you're being exposed to but someone needs to be providing some better information to you and the others working in those conditions.
Are they monitoring the air quality anywhere either inside or outside of the building you're working in? Is is just construction workers inside the building? Is the construction limited to only a few floors? What mitigation steps are being taken outside of the construction areas?

Contact OSHA, don't be bashfull; don't settle for the offical word unless you've got confidence that those issuing it have your best interest in mind.
 

Microwatt

Senior Member
Location
North Dakota
Doesn't sound like a great situation, but who knows what else is "around" the corner regarding something we use today but tomorrow is "bad". I don't want to make lite of what you're being exposed to but someone needs to be providing some better information to you and the others working in those conditions.
Are they monitoring the air quality anywhere either inside or outside of the building you're working in? Is is just construction workers inside the building? Is the construction limited to only a few floors? What mitigation steps are being taken outside of the construction areas?

Contact OSHA, don't be bashfull; don't settle for the offical word unless you've got confidence that those issuing it have your best interest in mind.


They have done air sample testing in the past and things have come back negative, but I think that could change on a day-to-day basis.

Would you belive it if I told you this was in a healthcare facility and the rooms that you can see the ACM through the return grates are exam rooms?
 

MJJBEE

Member
Not all fireproofing contains asbestos, so before getting excited be sure the material in question is ACM. Unless someone knows differently, you cannot tell ACM by looking at it, it has to be tested. If the material is in good condition, undisturbed and you will not cause it to become "friable", or airborne particulate by drilling, sanding, etc. not a problem. If your work would cause an issue, I would not continue until the problem is mitigated. AHERA and other regulations require management plans and recordkeeping for areas containing ACM. It is a hazard that I'm sure everyone here has been exposed to at some point. Floor tile and mastic, plaster, brake pads, pipe insulation. Common sense in working around it goes a long way
You missed a large one Wire Insulation most wiring installed in the 70's has some in it we find it all the time if people bother to test it. It is usualy not fryable and not dangerous but does have an impact on disposal fees
 
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