What will replace standard MH lights?

[SiddMartin]

From what I understand MH Pulse Start lights do not lose their light output as quickly as standard MH lights. Does anyone know what is a better option then MH or PS MH lights?? As far as efficient (sp?) and keeping the light output up?

I am wondering if LED will be the reality soon. Not sure of cost or if there is something else that will become the norm.

 

[drbond24]

LED is still too new to use in my opinion. You just need to go with fluorescent.

For example: Columbia Flourescent High Bay Lighting

They are more energy efficient, don't take 15 minutes to start, and (if you get the right one) are just as bright as a MH high bay fixture.

 

[nez]

T5 highbay fixtures use half the electricity for almost same light output as metal halide.

 

[benaround]

T5 highbay fixtures use half the electricity for almost same light output as metal halide.

And they can be 'a', 'b', switched for more savings!!

 

[SiddMartin]

Sorry I should have explained more.... I am talking more about site lighting

 

[jdsmith]

From what I understand MH Pulse Start lights do not lose their light output as quickly as standard MH lights. Does anyone know what is a better option then MH or PS MH lights?? As far as efficient (sp?) and keeping the light output up?

I am wondering if LED will be the reality soon. Not sure of cost or if there is something else that will become the norm.

The lumen depreciation of LEDs is still very high - meaning that the light output falls off fairly quickly. Many larger LED fixtures were rated at 100,000 hours life when they came out, but the lumen output was down to 40% of initial output at that 100,000 hour mark. This is quite deceiving and 40% is unacceptable to most people, so a lot of these same fixtures are now marketed as 60,000 hour fixtures with 60-65% of output at the 60,000 hour point.

We just installed about 2000 outdoor 165W induction fixtures in the last year. The output of induction is white, it is instant-on with no warmup or restrike time, and it is available in a variety of color temperatures. They are rated 100,000 hour life with 66% of initial lumens at 100,000 hours. They are also about $500-550 per fixture.

 

[weressl]

The lumen depreciation of LEDs is still very high - meaning that the light output falls off fairly quickly. Many larger LED fixtures were rated at 100,000 hours life when they came out, but the lumen output was down to 40% of initial output at that 100,000 hour mark. This is quite deceiving and 40% is unacceptable to most people, so a lot of these same fixtures are now marketed as 60,000 hour fixtures with 60-65% of output at the 60,000 hour point.

We just installed about 2000 outdoor 165W induction fixtures in the last year. The output of induction is white, it is instant-on with no warmup or restrike time, and it is available in a variety of color temperatures. They are rated 100,000 hour life with 66% of initial lumens at 100,000 hours. They are also about $500-550 per fixture.

Nor do they have an issue with mercury content. They CRI is very high, but I was not aware that they are available with many different K numbers.

 

[mikeames]

WOW I had no idea LED depreciated. I thought they wold be the exception to depreciation. Learn something new all the time. Maybe someoen could explain why??? Its logical that the gas in HID fixtures essentially wears out but whats happens to the diodes?

 

[SiddMartin]

The lumen depreciation of LEDs is still very high - meaning that the light output falls off fairly quickly. Many larger LED fixtures were rated at 100,000 hours life when they came out, but the lumen output was down to 40% of initial output at that 100,000 hour mark. This is quite deceiving and 40% is unacceptable to most people, so a lot of these same fixtures are now marketed as 60,000 hour fixtures with 60-65% of output at the 60,000 hour point.

We just installed about 2000 outdoor 165W induction fixtures in the last year. The output of induction is white, it is instant-on with no warmup or restrike time, and it is available in a variety of color temperatures. They are rated 100,000 hour life with 66% of initial lumens at 100,000 hours. They are also about $500-550 per fixture.

Thanks for the info, exactly some new stuff I was un-aware of!

 

[Mr. Bill]

I think eventually LEDs will replace MH lamps. Induction lamps are another possibility but they never seemed to catch on in site lighting. And LEDs have a big marketing engine pushing them forward. I just think there's still some years before I'm conviced they're worth the cost and meet the performance requirements.

I found this page on the DOE website about LED lumen depreciation.
http://www1.eere.energy.gov/buildings/ssl/depreciation.html
"The primary cause of lumen depreciation is heat generated at the LED junction. LEDs do not emit heat as infrared radiation (IR) like other light sources, so the heat must be removed from the device by conduction or convection. If the LED system design has inadequate heat sinking or other means of removing the heat, the device temperature will rise, resulting in lower light output. Clouding of the epoxy encapsulant used to cover some LED chips also results in decreased lumens making it out of the device. "

And another one from Philips.
http://www.philipslumileds.com/technology/lumenmaintenance.cfm

 

[bobsherwood]

I am testing LED in one of the parking garages here.. it's only been a month so I have no results yet. I only did six fixtures because I do not trust they are yet up to snuff.
The Student center was built here about 5 / 6 years ago with a bunch of recessed lights in a front and back porch. way way up there... I have been wondering why they have not gone out... turns out that they are induction lights. I never knew of induction lighting so I looked into it. I AM IMPRESSED.

 

[mcclary's electrical]

(6) 4' t8's in one fixture will replace a 400w MH

 

[jdsmith]

Nor do they have an issue with mercury content. They CRI is very high, but I was not aware that they are available with many different K numbers.

I double checked on the color temperature - Crouse Hinds (Phillips components) offers 3000K and 4000K.

 

[techntrek]

Never knew they had perfected induction flourescents. Now I know what I'm replacing 3 of my outdoor lights with (and adding a 4th).

 

[Mike01]

Induction

Induction

What about QL Induction 75-100K hours, good CRI multiple color temperatures etc. the systems have been around for 10-15 years but has always been pricy, however with LED's now in the picture they are still a point source, and still expensive where induction does cost more than MH / HPS, however less expensive than LED, good efficy, instant on, etc, we are seeing it become more and more of an acceptable solution in parking, site, and high bay or atrium instillations. Just another solution.

 

[jdsmith]

Never knew they had perfected induction flourescents. Now I know what I'm replacing 3 of my outdoor lights with (and adding a 4th).

I wouldn't say they've perfected them yet - we have had around a 3% failure rate in 9 months, with a sample size of 1710 fixtures.

 

[weressl]

I wouldn't say they've perfected them yet - we have had around a 3% failure rate in 9 months, with a sample size of 1710 fixtures.

That is not a bad infant mortality rate within the warranty period if you allow that some has to do with installation issues. When I say installation I am talking about the fixture manufacturer installing the Phillips driver/lamp combination AND the field installation.

Manufacturers no longer do individual testing and I think the various ways of how they still assure quality is failing.

 

[Steve-R]

The lumen depreciation of LEDs is still very high - meaning that the light output falls off fairly quickly. Many larger LED fixtures were rated at 100,000 hours life when they came out, but the lumen output was down to 40% of initial output at that 100,000 hour mark. This is quite deceiving and 40% is unacceptable to most people, so a lot of these same fixtures are now marketed as 60,000 hour fixtures with 60-65% of output at the 60,000 hour point.

We just installed about 2000 outdoor 165W induction fixtures in the last year. The output of induction is white, it is instant-on with no warmup or restrike time, and it is available in a variety of color temperatures. They are rated 100,000 hour life with 66% of initial lumens at 100,000 hours. They are also about $500-550 per fixture.

What manufacturer are you using? I've been interested in using induction lighting for some time, but I haven't been able to find many (any?) domestic manufacturers of induction lighting. It seems like potentially a really good source. LEDs have a long, long ways to go. Thanks!

 

[jdsmith]

What manufacturer are you using? I've been interested in using induction lighting for some time, but I haven't been able to find many (any?) domestic manufacturers of induction lighting. It seems like potentially a really good source. LEDs have a long, long ways to go. Thanks!

Here is a link to the Crouse Hinds lights we used.

I have seen two other styles of induction lights - we have a few 200W low bay lights that are about 3 ft tall that we're not very impressed with. We have a couple of induction wall packs installed that we haven't energized yet - I'll post back once we've tried them out.

 

[weressl]

What manufacturer are you using? I've been interested in using induction lighting for some time, but I haven't been able to find many (any?) domestic manufacturers of induction lighting. It seems like potentially a really good source. LEDs have a long, long ways to go. Thanks!

http://www.getdeco.com/products/induction/
http://www.uslightingtech.com/products.htmlhttp://www.uslightingtech.com/products.htmlhttp://www.uslightingtech.com/products.html
http://www.aeilighting.com/INDUCTION.htm?gclid=CIiNhf2-55sCFRkWswod2SH35Q
http://www.everlastlight.com/?gclid=CJ7D37W-55sCFQIMswoduwnv6A
http://www.nuvuelighting.com/UI/ProductsListing.aspx?mcid=3&pcid=3&ccid=3

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