Dish & Garb Together

[tryinghard]

Hey resi guy?s what?s your code input if I have the dish & garb (typical install with cords to a recept), and meet the criteria of 430.53 am I compliant with one 20A supply circuit?

 

[augie47]

Under which 430.53 are you compliant ?
It looks to me that (A) would apply if neither motor is over 1 HP but if either one is (over 1 HP) then (B) would be questionable for the smaller motor on a 20 amp circuit.

 

[e57]

I'm gonna refer back to this thread... Do you have specifications on both?

 

[tryinghard]

Not a MWBC if compliant with 430.53 (A) would be most common

 

[jaylectricity]

I learned to do that while doing a 43 unit multi-family. I've done it ever since and it has never been a problem.

Like others said, it depends on the motor size, but IMO you'll rarely run into that problem in a residence.

 

[e57]

~IMO you'll rarely run into that problem in a residence.

Depends on the residence... and the equipment... See also 210.21, and 210.23

 

[peter d]

I've put them both on a single 15 amp circuit before in a pinch. That same day the sky came crashing to the ground.

 

[tryinghard]

Now I'm home looking at my stuff and I have a 1/2hp garb with a 9A max load dishwasher. These are on one romex circuit but hey it's an old house (built in 29).

1/2hp = 9.8A x 125% = 12.5A + 9A = 21.25A for the circuit so 12-2 just slides in. But 430.53(B) now has to apply and in my case time has proved. Am I missing something though I can size the OCPD less than 250% so 9.8 + 9 = 18.8A sliding in on a 20A breaker?

 

[220/221]

am I compliant with one 20A supply circuit?

99% of the time, yes.

It is always done that way in my area, always has. Lately I have seen a couple of high end diswashers that draw over 10 amps but I've not seen a resi disp over 1 HP.

 

[chris kennedy]

1/2hp = 9.8A

Thats from T430.248. No amps on the name plate?

 

[tryinghard]

Thats from T430.248. No amps on the name plate?

No just a sticker lable 1/2hp, the manufacture spec is 6.5A "average amps"

 

[jaylectricity]

No just a sticker lable 1/2hp, the manufacture spec is 6.5A "average amps"

"Average" amps because it draws more when chewing up steak than when it's chewing up cucumbers?

 

[stew]

how does the 21+ amps "just slide in" for 12/2 romex? 14 =15 amps 12=20amps 10=30 amps per 240.4(D) or are you saying that 240.4 (G) applies to this? if so then i guess you are correct

 

[480sparky]

"Average" amps because it draws more when chewing up steak than when it's chewing up cucumbers?

Chucking cukes down the disposal, I can understand.

But steaks?????? :-?

 

[peter d]

Chucking cukes down the disposal, I can understand.

But steaks?????? :-?

Reminds me of a funny story a plumber told me. He got a call from a lady who went just a bit overboard using her disposer. He tried snaking the line to no avail. Anyway, it tuns out she used the thing so much in one episode she packed her waste lines solid. The plumber had to cut them all out and start over.

 

[480sparky]

Reminds me of a funny story a plumber told me. He got a call from a lady who went just a bit overboard using her disposer. He tried snaking the line to no avail. Anyway, it tuns out she used the thing so much in one episode she packed her waste lines solid. The plumber had to cut them all out and start over.

Last Thursday and Friday are the busiest times for most plumbing outfits. Think about it.

 

[LarryFine]

Lately I have seen a couple of high end diswashers that draw over 10 amps but I've not seen a resi disp over 1 HP.

Even then, I think a single 20a circuit would out-perform a pair of 15a circuits, due to simple load diversity.

 

[M. D.]

found this thought I'd share ,.. While I agree with the positions ,... these days I tend to run individual circuits 15 amp.. mostly .

http://216.247.219.82/htm/chapters/chapters/ECFcentralApr09.pdf

From: Ed Fox

I recently received the following email from an electrical contractor:

Ed
I have an interpretation question regarding Article 210.23 (2) – Utilization Equipment Fastened in Place.

The total rating of utilization equipment fastened in place, other than luminaires (lighting fixtures), shall not
exceed 50 percent of the branch-circuit ampere rating where lighting units, cord-and-plug-connected
utilization equipment not fastened in place, or both, are also supplied.

Normally, our company policy has been that we supply both the dishwasher and disposal with dedicated
circuits. With dishwashers typically less then 10 amps and disposals typically less then 7 amps, I would not
exceed the total ampere rating by combining the two appliances on one branch circuit. Since nothing else is
being supplied on that circuit, I believe we would meet code requirements. I have looked through related
articles in 240, 422, and 430 and find nothing contradicting this.

So my question to you is: Am I missing something or am I misinterpreting article 210.23?

Thanks for your time and consideration.
Heads up Electric

After researching the same articles my interpretation of article 210.23 is that you are correct. If you have a
dishwasher with a 10 amps maximum and a disposal that is less then 7 amps you could put them on the
same 20 amp branch circuit.

In these economic trying times everyone is trying to save a buck when they can. In knowing how to apply the
code sometimes you can accomplish it.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Let's face it. Even if the total load was 25 amps for the 2 units I don't believe you could ever blow the circuit unless you left that disposal on for a long time.

To avoid these issue I put the disposal & some kichen uc lights on the same 15 amp circuit

 

[electricguy61]

Many local jurisdictions in Northern CA require separate circuits for the dw, gd, and vent hood. Not required by NEC necessarily, but required by local code.