Water pipe Grounding not allowed by water company

[rickgomes26]

I'm with you.

Does any other profession (trade) have code geeks like us in the electrical industry?

If there is I haven't met em yet!

This is a weird one. If it were me doing the inspection I'd say establish your ground using the other permitted methods, isolate the incoming lines from the interior metal water piping directly after the backflow, and call it good.

 

[mistermudd]

I would install per NEC and not disconnect unless the electrical AHJ put it writing to disconnect.

 

[LarryFine]

I can see it now: "You can have water or electricity; pick one."

 

[jxofaltrds]

I would install per NEC and not disconnect unless the electrical AHJ put it writing to disconnect.

Would a redtag work?

How would you handle this:

"105.9 Responsibility.

It shall be the duty of every person who performs work for the installation or repair of building, structure, electrical, gas, mechanical or plumbing systems, for which this code is applicable, to comply with this code."

 

[winnie]

You don't need to make this into an ego match with the water department.

I'd suggest sending a polite letter to the water department, _totally agreeing_ with their requirements, and then asking for assistance in meeting the NEC requirements at the same time (and listing the NEC requirements). I'd similarly send a polite letter to the electrical department, _totally agreeing_ with following the electrical code as adopted in your local, and asking for assistance in meeting the water department requirements (and listing them).

There are possible solutions, but it requires coordination. jwjrw mentioned one possible solution in post #2: having a plastic incoming main.

You are _not_ required to use the incoming water pipe as a grounding electrode.

However you _are_ required to use all available grounding electrodes, so if the incoming water pipe meets the criteria for a grounding electrode then you _must_ use it.

This says to me that if the water company doesn't want their pipe uses as a grounding electrode, then it must somehow be rendered unsuitable as a grounding electrode.

You _must_ bond interior metallic water piping. If the incoming water pipe is metallic, and the interior water piping is metallic, then (intentional or not) the incoming water pipe will be used as a grounding electrode unless you do something to prevent this.

The gas company folk have been dealing with this exact issue for years. The solution that they use is a 'dielectric union'. The external gas pipe is electrically disconnected from the interior gas piping. The external gas pipe is unsuitable as a grounding electrode, the interior gas piping is bonded to the electrical system. No problem.

I am sure that if the local water company is motivated, they can get what they want without creating an electrical code violation.

-Jon

 

[dana1028]

Why not bury your connection? It doesn't say where you connect to the underground water line....attach it 5' or so away from where it enters the building....small trench [water is typically at least 12" below grade, more in cold country]....make your connection, pass the electrical inspection...bury the connection in the trench....Mr. Water doesn't see the connection.

Mr. Water doesn't see the connection, he's happy.:roll:

 

[Sierrasparky]

Why not bury your connection? It doesn't say where you connect to the underground water line....attach it 5' or so away from where it enters the building....small trench [water is typically at least 12" below grade, more in cold country]....make your connection, pass the electrical inspection...bury the connection in the trench....Mr. Water doesn't see the connection.

Mr. Water doesn't see the connection, he's happy.:roll:

I have been following this for some time. I like this creative solution. I like it a lot.

 

[jwjrw]

I have been following this for some time. I like this creative solution. I like it a lot.

I like it but....... I want to hear the AHJ say sure I will pass your job with an code violation. We feel the safety of the waterpipes is more important that human life........ Approved Approved Approved!

 

[Sierrasparky]

I like it but....... I want to hear the AHJ say sure I will pass your job with an code violation. We feel the safety of the waterpipes is more important that human life........ Approved Approved Approved!

Code violation??
where is there a violation. water boy's statement seems to be a code violation.

 

[jwjrw]

I was referring to not having it grounded. And I would want to cover myself. My luck they would find it and link it to " so called damage to the lines "and Id get sued!

 

[One-eyed Jack]

If there is I haven't met em yet!

This is a weird one. If it were me doing the inspection I'd say establish your ground using the other permitted methods, isolate the incoming lines from the interior metal water piping directly after the backflow, and call it good.

Go with the above. If you are "Bonding" you can hit the water pipe on the other side of the building. Out of sight,out of mind. If the AHJ bucks it. Give him the letter from the water dept. and let him make it right. If I were the EI I would then take it to the AHJ of the water dept. and inform them that it is their responsibility to "isolate" the water line .

 

[LarryFine]

You don't need to make this into an ego match with the water department.

(Everything in between)​

I am sure that if the local water company is motivated, they can get what they want without creating an electrical code violation.

I agree 100% with Jon's post.

 

[jwjrw]

Wouldnt you think the electrical inspection department has inspected other jobs that the water company supplies and would know what he needs to do?
We have plans reviewed and stamped here so I would think that would be shown but maybe not. Still a phone call should solve the issue.