"Waterbug" Wiring

[gadfly56]

This one is new for me. One of our salesmen sold a water detection system design/install to a customer. They have a very wet basement (~12 sump pumps) and wanted early warning if the pumps fail or are overwhelmed. The installation manual suggests 18-26 AWG with a maximum resistance of 50 ohms for each sensor run. The sensor "bugs" sit directly on the floor. The product is by Sensaphone. Although the specs don't say the transformer is Class 2 or 3, the input is 120 VAC at 6W. I'm thinking power limited wiring methods here, which negates a lot of chapter 3 in the NEC. However, I'm looking for suggestions which will produce an installation that is reasonably trouble-free as far as wiring in a wet location for power limited. Your advice is greatly appreciated.

 

[jwjrw]

Got any pics of the "bugs" or system in general?

 

[gadfly56]

Got any pics of the "bugs" or system in general?

Let's see if this works. Based on the image, I'll probably need to make a splice in the line.

 

[Buck Parrish]

I had a pump that cut on and off with that method. My opinion is that it was not reliable. I got rid of it. I can't imagine it not having false alarms.
Again in my opinion I would get out of this deal. Have the customer purchase something and you install it.
Just my 2 cents...

 

[gadfly56]

I had a pump that cut on and off with that method. My opinion is that it was not reliable. I got rid of it. I can't imagine it not having false alarms.
Again in my opinion I would get out of this deal. Have the customer purchase something and you install it.
Just my 2 cents...

The waterbug doesn't operate the pumps. It's strictly for alarming. It attaches to a dialer.

 

[Buck Parrish]

I know, may be it's okay. It just seems like it would need a little routine maintnance to keep it operating efficently. Does it have batteries in it?
See here
http://www.alarms247.com/fgd0013-spotwaterdetector.aspx

 

[cadpoint]

I think I'd tell the client to french drain the outside of their house, rework the lowest wall on the inside or what would be the lowest drain point and install french drains with wells, maybe include another branch! Sell them enough service for two pumps and a combination signal work / alarm.

 

[Buck Parrish]

I think I'd tell the client to french drain the outside of their house, rework the lowest wall on the inside or what would be the lowest drain point and install french drains with wells, maybe include another branch! Sell them enough service for two pumps and a combination signal work / alarm.

Me too, 12 sump pumps is rediculous for a residence. Even commercial, unless it is 10,000 sq ft.
I just cant see 12 sump pumps. May be thier counting the emergency pumps (battery back up dc pumps)

 

[nhfire77]

Waterbugs!!!


I've installed a ton of them. The sensors are class 2, typcially. I haven't seen one that isn't. They use water to close the circuit. When the water crosses the two terminals on the sensor, alarm.

As for wiring it, I would surface mount the cable at the ceiling level and maybe use some 1/2" EMT to sleeve it down the wall, with bang on bushings on both ends, if you are worried they will be subjected to physical damage. You could wire the whole thing in NM or MC , just test it on a coil of cable first. The manual states18-26 Ga, but I think 12 or 14 should be fine on them. I know why you mean, you want to make it a trouble free install, but this seems to be the way that limits the problems for me.

There are sump pump failure monitors. They are cheap. You would want to use the waterbugs and the failure monitor together.


You do not HAVE to mount the sensors to the floor, you can mount it on the wall, 1/8" off the floor. This prevents false alarms from a small amount of water and reduces chances for damage.

PM me if you want more info. I don't have it right here .

 

[gadfly56]

Me too, 12 sump pumps is rediculous for a residence. Even commercial, unless it is 10,000 sq ft.
I just cant see 12 sump pumps. May be thier counting the emergency pumps (battery back up dc pumps)

This is a commercial property. It looks to be about 8,000 sqft. From what I understand, there is a re-routed brook that keeps trying to run where it used to.

 

[Buck Parrish]

ohhh, okay, yep sounds good, I like the ideal of mounting them on the wall. good luck.

 

[charlietuna]

Sensaphone water sensors are class two wiring -- just figure out where the sensor needs to be for earliest warning and protect the class two wire from damage between the waterbug and the "Sensaphone" panel. I think they have a good product. We use them to monitor computer rooms.

 

[MisterCMK]

Rather than using a waterbug, which will tell you when the sump basket has already overflowed, you may want to consider a cellar saver. These are a contact with a float arm that gets attached to the discharge pipe of the pump. When the water gets above a certain level the contact opens. I used these on a friend's farm house and he had a sump pump fail. When the central station called him he was able to go downstairs and get the shop vac going before he had a big mess on his hands.

 

[TwinCitySparky]

FWIW -

For residential, you can add a "watercop" to monitor and control the city supplied water as well.

http://www.watercop.com/

 

[Rob454]

We install waterbugs. theire connected to a dialer. usually they go in basements or elevator shafts sometimes in places liek fire pump rooms at highrise buildings