Youth summer camp buildings.

[hourglass52]

I am having trouble finding code on the youth summer camp bunks.
These are sleeping quarters.
Are ARC fault breakers required. I say yes other electricians say no. Or they have no idea.
These buildings were built in the 1940's and 3 just burned down after a service upgrade.

 

[augie47]

Take a look at 210.12 (& 210.18) then look at the definition of a "dwelling unit" in Art 100 and see if your situation applies.

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

Not likely they include cooking so not required but sure not a bad idea. I would be real concerned about the 3 that burned down. What was the cause ?

 

[cowboyjwc]

I think you would most likely fall under guest rooms or guest suites. You would really have to look in the building code and I would think there that you would qualify as a dormitory.

I wouldn't think that arc-faults could be required, but as Jim said, not a bad idea.

 

[steve66]

Not likely they include cooking so not required but sure not a bad idea. I would be real concerned about the 3 that burned down. What was the cause ?

I'd be real concerned too. They lasted 70 years, and after a service upgrade (which should have made them safer) 3 burnt down??

I would really question the quality of the work that was involved in the upgrade (assuming someone else did that), unless you know something we don't (like maybe the residents started the fires with hotplates or something similar.)

 

[mxslick]

Only on this site will you hear about buildings burning down AFTER a service upgrade. :roll:

Sounds like the entire electrical installation needs to be given a very close look.

 

[hourglass52]

Buildings

Buildings

I don't have proof of why the camp buildings burned. The camp is closed, and they were just getting started for the season.
The camp is in the country, and I have worked on some old houses in the area. I am always finding chewed wires in those old houses.
I find it suspicious that the buildings burned 48 hours after thay were energized.
It made me think about the ARC faults. Then I started looking at code.
The buildings are not a dwelling unit by definition, but they are sleeping quarters.
I believe that ARC faults are called for in these buildings.

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

Them burning within 48 hours says something very wrong. Were they without power for long period of time before the upgrade ? If so might easily had rodents eating insulation while power was off. Hopefully someone is looking into this. As to needing afci i would view this as more like a motel unit without cooking. We are talking about kids sleeping so hope they have good smokes. Would not want to tell the parents there kids are dead because we saved money by not putting in afci breakers. Might be some money to be made here by megging out the buildings.

 

[mxslick]

I don't have proof of why the camp buildings burned. The camp is closed, and they were just getting started for the season.
The camp is in the country, and I have worked on some old houses in the area. I am always finding chewed wires in those old houses.
I find it suspicious that the buildings burned 48 hours after thay were energized.
It made me think about the ARC faults. Then I started looking at code.
The buildings are not a dwelling unit by definition, but they are sleeping quarters.
I believe that ARC faults are called for in these buildings.

Them burning within 48 hours says something very wrong. Were they without power for long period of time before the upgrade ? If so might easily had rodents eating insulation while power was off. Hopefully someone is looking into this. As to needing afci i would view this as more like a motel unit without cooking. We are talking about kids sleeping so hope they have good smokes. Would not want to tell the parents there kids are dead because we saved money by not putting in afci breakers. Might be some money to be made here by megging out the buildings.

I think the above highlighted points seals the deal. Code or Not, put in the afci's. If I were involved it would be that or I walk away. Too much risk to take on using standard breakers here.

I would also insist on performing visual and megger tests on the remaining buildings.

 

[KWH]

Arc Faults

Arc Faults

I recently did some new cabins for a YMCA camp put the ARC Faults in , you can go both ways on the code but in this situation go with the breakers