Tying egc together

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R

romeo

Senior Member
Where in the code does it require that all egc be tied together at a j box or outlet box?

I can't find it in Articale 250.

Thanks in advance.
 
chris kennedy

chris kennedy

Senior Member
Location
Miami Fla.
Occupation
60 yr old tool twisting electrician
iwire said:
You do have to splice all EGCs present in a box together.

250.148.


(Other than IGs)
Click to expand...


Here is the wording, could you highlight the part that directs you to connect all of them?



250.148 Continuity and Attachment of Equipment Grounding Conductors to Boxes.

Where circuit conductors are spliced within a box, or terminated on equipment within or supported by a box, any equipment grounding conductor(s) associated with those circuit conductors shall be connected within the box or to the box with devices suitable for the use in accordance with 250.148(A) through (E).


Exception: The equipment grounding conductor permitted in 250.146(D) shall not be required to be connected to the other equipment grounding conductors or to the box.

(A) Connections. Connections and splices shall be made in accordance with 110.14(B) except that insulation shall not be required.

(B) Grounding Continuity. The arrangement of grounding connections shall be such that the disconnection or the removal of a receptacle, luminaire, or other device fed from the box does not interfere with or interrupt the grounding continuity.

(C) Metal Boxes. A connection shall be made between the one or more equipment grounding conductors and a metal box by means of a grounding screw that shall be used for no other purpose, equipment listed for grounding, or a listed grounding device.

(D) Nonmetallic Boxes. One or more equipment grounding conductors brought into a nonmetallic outlet box shall be arranged such that a connection can be made to any fitting or device in that box requiring grounding.

(E) Solder. Connections depending solely on solder shall not be used.
 
iwire

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
chris kennedy said:
Here is the wording, could you highlight the part that directs you to connect all of them?



250.148 Continuity and Attachment of Equipment Grounding Conductors to Boxes.

Where circuit conductors are spliced within a box, or terminated on equipment within or supported by a box, any equipment grounding conductor(s) associated with those circuit conductors shall be connected within the box or to the box with devices suitable for the use in accordance with 250.148(A) through (E).


Exception: The equipment grounding conductor permitted in 250.146(D) shall not be required to be connected to the other equipment grounding conductors or to the box.

(A) Connections. Connections and splices shall be made in accordance with 110.14(B) except that insulation shall not be required.

(B) Grounding Continuity. The arrangement of grounding connections shall be such that the disconnection or the removal of a receptacle, luminaire, or other device fed from the box does not interfere with or interrupt the grounding continuity.

(C) Metal Boxes. A connection shall be made between the one or more equipment grounding conductors and a metal box by means of a grounding screw that shall be used for no other purpose, equipment listed for grounding, or a listed grounding device.

(D) Nonmetallic Boxes. One or more equipment grounding conductors brought into a nonmetallic outlet box shall be arranged such that a connection can be made to any fitting or device in that box requiring grounding.

(E) Solder. Connections depending solely on solder shall not be used.
Click to expand...

Take the two red sections together and there is no way not to connect all the spliced or terminated EGCs together in a metal box.
 
V

Volta

Senior Member
Location
Columbus, Ohio
iwire said:
Take the two red sections together and there is no way not to connect all the spliced or terminated EGCs together in a metal box.
Click to expand...

If the EGC is spliced, then yes, it must be connected to the other EGCs that are also spliced in that box.

However, if an EGC and its circuit conductors simply pass through the enclosure it is not required to be connected to any other EGC.
 
iwire

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
Volta said:
If the EGC is spliced, then yes, it must be connected to the other EGCs that are also spliced in that box.

However, if an EGC and its circuit conductors simply pass through the enclosure it is not required to be connected to any other EGC.
Click to expand...


Yeah that is what 250.148 says. :grin:
 
yucan2

yucan2

Senior Member
Location
Just south of Chicago
Volta said:
If the EGC is spliced, then yes, it must be connected to the other EGCs that are also spliced in that box.

However, if an EGC and its circuit conductors simply pass through the enclosure it is not required to be connected to any other EGC.
Click to expand...

Amended to, I agree. :grin:
 
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chris kennedy

chris kennedy

Senior Member
Location
Miami Fla.
Occupation
60 yr old tool twisting electrician
iwire said:
Take the two red sections together and there is no way not to connect all the spliced or terminated EGCs together in a metal box.
Click to expand...

Agreed. But lets say the OP has a metal wireway above two panels with multiple conduit entries and nipples into the panels. All conduits meet the requirements of 250.118 yet specs call out a wire EGC also. One circuit has conductors entering the wireway from multiple conduits so a joint is made in the gutter. Those associated EGC's are splices together and pigtailed to the gutter. All other EGC's pass through the wireway unbroken to the ground bars in the panels. Compliant? I believe so.
 
Y

yired29

Senior Member
chris kennedy said:
Agreed. But lets say the OP has a metal wireway above two panels with multiple conduit entries and nipples into the panels. All conduits meet the requirements of 250.118 yet specs call out a wire EGC also. One circuit has conductors entering the wireway from multiple conduits so a joint is made in the gutter. Those associated EGC's are splices together and pigtailed to the gutter. All other EGC's pass through the wireway unbroken to the ground bars in the panels. Compliant? I believe so.
Click to expand...

I agree. As long as no other circuit conductors are spliced in the wireway.
 
mcclary's electrical

mcclary's electrical

Senior Member
Location
VA
chris kennedy said:
Agreed. But lets say the OP has a metal wireway above two panels with multiple conduit entries and nipples into the panels. All conduits meet the requirements of 250.118 yet specs call out a wire EGC also. One circuit has conductors entering the wireway from multiple conduits so a joint is made in the gutter. Those associated EGC's are splices together and pigtailed to the gutter. All other EGC's pass through the wireway unbroken to the ground bars in the panels. Compliant? I believe so.
Click to expand...



I believe so,,,,,but lets stretch it a bit further.

A switch box in a bathroom has 2 switches fed from 14 guage circuit, and a GFI fed from a 12 guage circuit. By the wording, It would require all grounds to land under a wirenut, and bond the box(if metal)

But what if it's a nonmetallic box, the 14's hit one greenie, and the 12's land under another greenie, and then both go the their prospective devices without ever coming together. Violation?
 
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Y

yired29

Senior Member
What I see missed the most is the connection to the metal box. Most think if it is installed in a metal raceway there is no need to make a connection to the metal enclosure. I believe once you install a wire EGC the metal raceway is just installed as a raceway not the EGC as allowed in 250.118. Thats the way I understand 250.148 (C).
 
V

Volta

Senior Member
Location
Columbus, Ohio
mcclary's electrical said:
I believe so,,,,,but lets stretch it a bit further.

A switch box in a bathroom has 2 switches fed from 14 guage circuit, and a GFI fed from a 12 guage circuit. By the wording, It would require all grounds to land under a wirenut, and bond the box(if metal)

But what if it's a nonmatellic box, the 14's hit one greenie, and the 12's land under another greenie, and then both go the their prospective devices without ever coming together. Violation?
Click to expand...

In my opinion that would be a violation.

250.148 says, "...any equipment grounding conductor(s) associated with those circuit conductors shall be connected within the box...".

Seems like they need to be connected within the box, to me.
 
chris kennedy

chris kennedy

Senior Member
Location
Miami Fla.
Occupation
60 yr old tool twisting electrician
mcclary's electrical said:
I believe so,,,,,but lets stretch it a bit further.

A switch box in a bathroom has 2 switches fed from 14 guage circuit, and a GFI fed from a 12 guage circuit. By the wording, It would require all grounds to land under a wirenut, and bond the box(if metal)

But what if it's a nonmatellic box, the 14's hit one greenie, and the 12's land under another greenie, and then both go the their prospective devices without ever coming together. Violation?
Click to expand...

Agreeing with Volta.
 
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V

Volta

Senior Member
Location
Columbus, Ohio
yired29 said:
What I see missed the most is the connection to the metal box. Most think if it is installed in a metal raceway there is no need to make a connection to the metal enclosure. I believe once you install a wire EGC the metal raceway is just installed as a raceway not the EGC as allowed in 250.118. Thats the way I understand 250.148 (C).
Click to expand...

The metal raceway is still an EGC. We just pretend that it is not spliced within the box (with locknuts). :grin:
 
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