Split Bolts?

[Foghorn]

I have a customer that will not accept any split bolt, under any circumstances. He requires the use of crimps, and silbronze bolts to make wire to wire connections. This specific application is 480v, 30a.

I have tried to find why some folks dislike splitbolts, but have been unscessful in finding a reason.
All I find are that some folks have no issues, and others hate splitbolts. (fonud some interesting NAMES for them)

Can you help me understand +'s & -'s? Likes / dislikes? & :grin: & & :-?

I understand the dissimilar metal issues, but in this instance the conductors are all copper, and well taped (Cambric, Rubber (70), Fiberglass (69), Vinyl (+33)).

 

[iwire]

Split bolts are horse and buggy items at this point I would chose almost any other way of connecting conductors over a split bolt.

 

[peter d]

Yeah, split bolts are good for bare grounding/bonding wires and nothing much else. It's time electricians got on board with modern products.

 

[dieselram752]

I have never heard of anyone not liking split bolts.
Only thing bad about them is the labor to install and insulate:-?

 

[readydave8]

Split bolts are cheap and don't require special tools. So they must not be as good?

 

[infinity]

Split bolts are horse and buggy items at this point I would chose almost any other way of connecting conductors over a split bolt.

I agree completely. There are many other better choices. I would choose one that had a set screw that can torqued so there's no guessing that it's tight enough. Better yet a compression connector.

 

[jeremysterling]

480V 30A sounds like a red wire nut to me. Are these #10's?

I agree with the others. You must use a lot of tape on the split bolt. My boss insists on crimp buttsplices and coldshrink for feeder splices.

 

[domnic]

split bolts

split bolts

Split bolts are the are the best.

 

[ohmhead]

A split bolt can not stay tight it will and can over time have a bad connection will it work yes but is it a good connection no think crimp a Brundy crimp thats installed at 3000 lbs will not come off ever but a split bolt can .

There made they have been around for a long time most jobs we do we crimp all aluminum wire and copper wire in motors its spec by engineer .


We use split bolts on temp power only because its cheap when you use bigg wire in a junction box you can add things with a split bolt or if its damage during construction its easy to repair or put back together they have there purpose .

Let me ask you this if you were on a operating table having open heart surgery and the hospital power to that O R was all on split bolts and if power was shut down or lost think of it lose connection or voltage drop or major fault or vibration even a small tiny motor that operates for equipment for your life .

We even crimp our grounding bars in electrical rooms to bus bars!

If you do commercial work its not done so who ever your working for has good sense hes ok in my book .

Heat cold becomes a problem !

Vibration problem !

High resistance connection !

Labor waste material waste !

Air gaps corrosion air between copper and aluminum oxidization on conductors surface over time under that tape because its not sealed as good as it could be like a crimp !

 

[iwire]

Split bolts are the are the best.

At what? Certainly not for splicing.

 

[kwired]

I agree completely. There are many other better choices. I would choose one that had a set screw that can torqued so there's no guessing that it's tight enough. Better yet a compression connector.

You don't have a torque wrench that will fit a split bolt?

A split bolt can not stay tight it will and can over time have a bad connection will it work yes but is it a good connection no think crimp a Brundy crimp thats installed at 3000 lbs will not come off ever but a split bolt can .

There made they have been around for a long time most jobs we do we crimp all aluminum wire and copper wire in motors its spec by engineer .


We use split bolts on temp power only because its cheap when you use bigg wire in a junction box you can add things with a split bolt or if its damage during construction its easy to repair or put back together they have there purpose .

Let me ask you this if you were on a operating table having open heart surgery and the hospital power to that O R was all on split bolts and if power was shut down or lost think of it lose connection or voltage drop or major fault or vibration even a small tiny motor that operates for equipment for your life .

We even crimp our grounding bars in electrical rooms to bus bars!

If you do commercial work its not done so who ever your working for has good sense hes ok in my book .

Heat cold becomes a problem !

Vibration problem !

High resistance connection !

Labor waste material waste !

Air gaps corrosion air between copper and aluminum oxidization on conductors surface over time under that tape because its not sealed as good as it could be like a crimp !

Any mechanical connector can fail for the same reasons.

I do not prefer split bolts either. Definately not for aluminum at all. Using them on copper may be acceptable, I save used split bolts that are in good condition to make temporary and emergency connections. Seldom use for anything I intend to leave permanently.

 

[ohmhead]

You don't have a torque wrench that will fit a split bolt?




Any mechanical connector can fail for the same reasons.

I do not prefer split bolts either. Definately not for aluminum at all. Using them on copper may be acceptable, I save used split bolts that are in good condition to make temporary and emergency connections. Seldom use for anything I intend to leave permanently.

I disagree with your statement not a crimp they dont come apart ever but a split bolt would and you can seal a crimp better then any split bolt there two different connections .

We never use a split bolt ever unless its temp power

 

[peter d]

A split bolt can not stay tight it will and can over time have a bad connection will it work yes but is it a good connection no think crimp a Brundy crimp thats installed at 3000 lbs will not come off ever but a split bolt can .

After I deciphered this 3rd grade level sentence I must say I disagree. There are countless millions of split bolts that have been in use for decades without the slightest problem whatsoever. What is this magical force that is causing them to loosen up over time?

That said, split bolts are ancient outdated technology.

 

[ohmhead]

After I deciphered this 3rd grade level sentence I must say I disagree. There are countless millions of split bolts that have been in use for decades without the slightest problem whatsoever. What is this magical force that is causing them to loosen up over time?

That said, split bolts are ancient outdated technology.

let me say this so you can understand better there no good ! Its a bad connection crimps are better when you put that high pressure on that crimp its not coming off kinda common sense .

Do you do commercial work have you ever done high voltage work the question was about a split bolt . Yes there kinda out dated and no one really uses them most engineers spec crimps today because of the above facts and the cost of a 40 million dollar electrical project and a 1000 dollar project .
Lets tell IBM or Sprint there power went off because we used a split bolt and its legal per the NEC .

If your bonding insurance can take the hit then go for it and your companys rep .

So now tell me how there the same do you think a split bolt is really better today with the way we all use power today in our high tech world .

What kind of crimp tools have you used not many huh ?

 

[peter d]

let me say this so you can understand better there no good ! Its a bad connection crimps are better when you put that high pressure on that crimp its not coming off kinda common sense .

Do you do commercial work have you ever done high voltage work the question was about a split bolt . Yes there kinda out dated and no one really uses them most engineers spec crimps today because of the above facts and the cost of a 40 million dollar electrical project and a 1000 dollar project .
Lets tell IBM or Sprint there power went off because we used a split bolt and its legal per the NEC .

If your bonding insurance can take the hit then go for it and your companys rep .

So now tell me how there the same do you think a split bolt is really better today with the way we all use power today in our high tech world .

What kind of crimp tools have you used not many huh ?

Besides your opinion, do you have anything to back up the claim that "there no good" ?

I don't understand how a split bolt that makes a safe and reliable connection for decade after decade and there are millions of them in use is "no good."

 

[BJ Conner]

Besides your opinion, do you have anything to back up the claim that "there no good" ?

I don't understand how a split bolt that makes a safe and reliable connection for decade after decade and there are millions of them in use is "no good."

I agree with you. They are UL and CSA listed. Kearneys with Scotch pad insulation make a quick good splice. You can do it with the tools most electricans have. If I had to I think I could find some that have been working 40 years.

 

[ohmhead]

Besides your opinion, do you have anything to back up the claim that "there no good" ?



I don't understand how a split bolt that makes a safe and reliable connection for decade after decade and there are millions of them in use is "no good."

Well the NEC uses the key word loose in 250.64 C

These methods create a permanent connection that will not become LOOSE after installation .

Meaning irreversible at 3000 plus it does not come loose were not talking about a hand crimp in your tool pouch were talking about a crimping tool.



And 1/0 to 1000 mcm wire you just dont use split bolts .

 

[btharmy]

And 1/0 to 1000 mcm wire you just dont use split bolts .

I get it, you don't like split bolts. I thought, however, the topic was a 30a. cir.

 

[kwired]

I disagree with your statement not a crimp they dont come apart ever but a split bolt would and you can seal a crimp better then any split bolt there two different connections .

We never use a split bolt ever unless its temp power

In my statement in post 11, I said any mechanical connector and was not referring to compression connectors. I do feel that the high pressure compression connectors are about the best thing there is for connections if installed properly. I have seen some failures that were not installed properly.

Any mechanical connector means set screw type connectors and lugs also. Some people were giving me the impression that they believed a split bolt would loosen from vibration but something like a Polaris tap would not. I do not believe this to be true.

 

[peter d]

Well the NEC uses the key word loose in 250.64 C

These methods create a permanent connection that will not become LOOSE after installation .

Yeah, in that particular instance for grounding conductors the code calls for irreversible methods. For all the rest of the conductors, a split bolt is fine. By the way, you can still use split bolts for taps to a GEC.

Meaning irreversible at 3000 plus it does not come loose were not talking about a hand crimp in your tool pouch were talking about a crimping tool.

I'm well aware of the crimp connectors we are talking about. Again, how does a properly torqued split bolt loosen up over time?

And 1/0 to 1000 mcm wire you just dont use split bolts .

I agree that with all that's available now it would be pretty foolish to use them. But Burndy still makes them up to 1000 kcmil size and they were used for decades on all sizes of wire before all the modern stuff came on the market.


I am not advocating the use of split bolts with all the modern products available today. But I believe your claim that split bolts are "no good" is totally bogus.