Would you bill

[kbrandt]

Hi guys was wondering what you would do in this situation.

A guy i have know for 18 years ask me to install 2 gfci receps in each bathroom on his rental house. It is 40 miles one way. (did not want to drive and look at and not get the job, too far) So I asked is it all drywall, he says yes, can I get in the attic, yes again. And he has worked in construction, so I went with his word.

Well one wall was drywall and the other was plaster with 2x6's horizontal all over the wall. Took 2 hours to get cut in box hole cut, with chisling and cutting wood. Well one 1/8 of an inch to go, I hit a plastic water line, could not see it, and he failed to tell me that new water lines had been installed. My fault O.K. I should of checked further up with flashlight. Turned it off in seconds, not much water came out, cleaned right up.

He called plumber, cut a 12 x 12 inches on other side, done in 45 minutes.
I finished the gfci and did the other bath in 20 minutes.

I put conduit on outside wall from panel, j-box, romex to both baths and 2 gfci's. Bid 3 hours took 5.5 because of plaster. Price I bid $373.00.

I don't think he wants to pay, and I told him if we cut drywall to install electrical, he would have to repair. He said fine. Waterline plumber fixed he paid. Probably $85.00 to $125.00.

Would you expect to get paid or forget about the whole job?

He is retired from the phone company and is well off, and tight.

Just seeing what you guys think, or would do.
Thanks

 

[Little Bill]

Hi guys was wondering what you would do in this situation.

A guy i have know for 18 years ask me to install 2 gfci receps in each bathroom on his rental house. It is 40 miles one way. (did not want to drive and look at and not get the job, too far) So I asked is it all drywall, he says yes, can I get in the attic, yes again. And he has worked in construction, so I went with his word.

Well one wall was drywall and the other was plaster with 2x6's horizontal all over the wall. Took 2 hours to get cut in box hole cut, with chisling and cutting wood. Well one 1/8 of an inch to go, I hit a plastic water line, could not see it, and he failed to tell me that new water lines had been installed. My fault O.K. I should of checked further up with flashlight. Turned it off in seconds, not much water came out, cleaned right up.

He called plumber, cut a 12 x 12 inches on other side, done in 45 minutes.
I finished the gfci and did the other bath in 20 minutes.

I put conduit on outside wall from panel, j-box, romex to both baths and 2 gfci's. Bid 3 hours took 5.5 because of plaster. Price I bid $373.00.

I don't think he wants to pay, and I told him if we cut drywall to install electrical, he would have to repair. He said fine. Waterline plumber fixed he paid. Probably $85.00 to $125.00.

Would you expect to get paid or forget about the whole job?

He is retired from the phone company and is well off, and tight.

Just seeing what you guys think, or would do.
Thanks

I believe I would ask for the bid amount and "eat" the extra 2.5 hrs. because of the water line problem. Have a serious "hear to heart" with him about the plaster wall if he objects. But I would be paid.

 

[petersonra]

You actually drove 40 miles one way to install a few GFCIs?

 

[controlled]

As said previously, I would demand the quoted 373.00, and just forget the rest.

 

[kbrandt]

Ever been in S. Arizona? Everything is far away. 25 miles from small town I live in to grocery store. Plus I have known him for years, kinda a favor thing.

Otherwise would of never went.

Attic work and direct sun in AZ this time of year--pure hell. Leather gloves and you still feel the heat on metal. But I do it, you know feed the family thing.

And as they say back east--but its a dry heat, so is an oven.

But thats AZ.

 

[Rick Christopherson]

Nevermind. I didn't see in your posting where this was supposed to be a paying job. I thought it was a freebie for a friend.

 

[97catintenn]

I wouldn't persue it for a couple of weeks. Let him think on his about the amount of work you did do and send him a bill in the mail in two weeks.

It's hard to be patient with money.

 

[mccayry]

I absolutely hate doing work for friends or family. I just try to avoid it if all possible.

 

[growler]

It is 40 miles one way.

He called plumber, cut a 12 x 12 inches on other side, done in 45 minutes.
I Waterline plumber fixed he paid. Probably $85.00 to $125.00

What makes you think it's not a 40 mile trip for the plumber one way? If it is a 40 mile trip then what would make you think the plumber would be so cheap?

Maybe the plumber doesn't know him and wants to stick it to him or maybe the plumber does know him and wants to stick it to him ( it happens ). :slaphead:

 

[Chamuit]

Ever been in S. Arizona? Everything is far away. 25 miles from small town I live in to grocery store. Plus I have known him for years, kinda a favor thing.

Otherwise would of never went.

Attic work and direct sun in AZ this time of year--pure hell. Leather gloves and you still feel the heat on metal. But I do it, you know feed the family thing.

And as they say back east--but its a dry heat, so is an oven.

But thats AZ.

I think your price is fair enough. As for the water pipe, he should know sh*tuff happens. I'd bill him and find out what kind of friend he is.

 

[220/221]

IMO, you are responsible for the plumbing. There may be cases where plumbing may be a surprise but the bathroom isn't one of them.

As far as what he owes you, that depends on the contract. If you said "install 20 amp circuits/receps in bathrooms, $373", that's what it is.

If you put contingencies in there (not responsibe for drywall patch), it may be a different story. If it was left vauge, again that's your responsibility.


This job sucks sometimes, huh?



Also, you bid that WAY too low. Retro bath circuit = $589 minimum if thats the only thing going on at the site.

 

[kwired]

I absolutely hate doing work for friends or family. I just try to avoid it if all possible.

So if you become friends with a client you have to stop working for them?

I'd say about 75% of my work comes from people that I call friends, if you don't become friends with repeat clients then they likely do not remain repeat clients. Doesn't mean you have to spend weekends with them or invite them to family events, just be friends.

 

[growler]

IMO, you are responsible for the plumbing. There may be cases where plumbing may be a surprise but the bathroom isn't one of them.

As far as what he owes you, that depends on the contract. If you said "install 20 amp circuits/receps in bathrooms, $373", that's what it is.

Also, you bid that WAY too low. Retro bath circuit = $589 minimum if thats the only thing going on at the site.

220-221 makes a darn good point here. I agree that the electrician is responsible for any damage to the property. They agreed that sheetrock to be patched by owner but the plumbing is the electrician's responsibility.

The job was to cheap but that doesn't eliminate any of the responsibility.

 

[augie47]

I agree with 220/221, the plumbing cost should be yours.
He owes for your quote minus the plumbers charge.
The drywall work might be debatable. If you cut my drywall and we did not agree repairs were my responsibility, I would expect you to cover that also.
I may be way off base, but, to me, you quoted (too low) to install the two outlets and your expenses are not my problem.
I would consider it as "education" for the next bid.

 

[GUNNING]

Electrician vs contractor

Electrician vs contractor

What was your intent when you agreed to do the work?

Send him a bill for the work. Discount it if he calls and complains.

Rental? 40 miles? He is a retired phone guy and this is extra income for him?

I think the money will be there but not right away. It doesn't hurt to ask.

Money is a socially embarrassing subject for some. You are in business, not the electrician fairy. You can't be in business for long giving your work and assets away, that makes it a hobby. :slaphead:
Think of this as a way of strengthening your collection skills.

Then get an agreement together written with clauses addressing payment, damages, time frame, scope of work, address's and phone numbers, responsible parties etc... It will stop this from happening in the future and make you a contractor not an electrician.

 

[220/221]

Money is a socially embarrassing subject for some

That is an interesting statement. It describes me to a tee. Some people feel guilty or something if they charge "too much". It's really stupid but it's real.

Fortunately, I have a business partner that is very good with money and he does all the estimating.

 

[Teaspoon]

I think your price is fair enough. As for the water pipe, he should know sh*tuff happens. I'd bill him and find out what kind of friend he is.

I agree bill him.If he gets mad over it he is not your friend.
You are working for a living,you stated he is retired from the phone company.Bill him.

 

[mccayry]

So if you become friends with a client you have to stop working for them?

I'd say about 75% of my work comes from people that I call friends, if you don't become friends with repeat clients then they likely do not remain repeat clients. Doesn't mean you have to spend weekends with them or invite them to family events, just be friends.

Im referring to close family and people you grew up with. Sometimes I feel like I should give them a deal but really cant afford to. But thanks for the advice:thumbsdown:

 

[Little Bill]

Im referring to close family and people you grew up with. Sometimes I feel like I should give them a deal but really cant afford to. But thanks for the advice:thumbsdown:

If it's family (or a very close friend), I just do what they need done after hours or weekends. If it's just casual friends I book them and might give them a little cut, mostly to pass my name around, without disclosing that I gave them a little break.

 

[kbrandt]

Just an update:

Got a call from this customer and he had no problem with paying the bid amount. I of course ate the 2 hours. And he said don't worry about the waterline, it happens.

Faith restored!

Thanks guys, I can always count on you for advice and expertize. 22 years in the trade and still learning.