grounded conductor

[paul renshaw]

404.2(C) does this apply also to all locations of 3-ways and 4-ways? For example I have seen ,what I call a dead end 3-way, wired in a house where there is only a piece of 14-3 coming to the box, and everything else was made up at the other end.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

404.2(C) does this apply also to all locations of 3-ways and 4-ways? For example I have seen ,what I call a dead end 3-way, wired in a house where there is only a piece of 14-3 coming to the box, and everything else was made up at the other end.

Unless you have an amendment as Ma does then yes- it applies across the board. No more dead end 3 ways.

 

[jumper]

Unless you have an amendment as Ma does then yes- it applies across the board. No more dead end 3 ways.

14/4 or 12/4.

 

[paul renshaw]

thanks

 

[Dennis Alwon]

14/4 or 12/4.

Of course but it has a neutral and most of us can't get 12/4 or 14/4 unless it is a special order. I think MA. allows just one switch of the 3 way / 4 ways to have to have a neutral.

 

[jumper]

Of course but it has a neutral and most of us can't get 12/4 or 14/4 unless it is a special order. I think MA. allows just one switch of the 3 way / 4 ways to have to have a neutral.

You are right OP said house. I did not see that. My brain went to MC in which 12/4 is a common item.

 

[infinity]

But isn't there an exception that says if the top or bottom area above the switch is accessible, (like an attic or basement) that the neutral is not required?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

But isn't there an exception that says if the top or bottom area above the switch is accessible, (like an attic or basement) that the neutral is not required?

Yep, which, IMO is BS. It doesn't mean someone will install it. It also does not state that it must be accesible-- if there is a perlin in the wall there is no access to the box but the wording does not address that.

 

[Little Bill]

Of course but it has a neutral and most of us can't get 12/4 or 14/4 unless it is a special order. I think MA. allows just one switch of the 3 way / 4 ways to have to have a neutral.

Do your SHs carry 12-2-2 or 14-2-2?

 

[Volta]

I suppose one could argue that a branch-circuit that serves only lighting loads is not subject to sub-section 404.2(C) anyhow. Just don't feed receptacles or other directly-wired appliances.

Branch Circuit, General-Purpose. A branch circuit that
supplies two or more receptacles or outlets for lighting and
appliances.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Do your SHs carry 12-2-2 or 14-2-2?

Heck they never even heard of it.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I suppose one could argue that a branch-circuit that serves only lighting loads is not subject to sub-section 404.2(C) anyhow. Just don't feed receptacles or other directly-wired appliances.

Branch Circuit, General-Purpose. A branch circuit that supplies two or more receptacles or outlets for lighting and appliances.

You could argue it but I don't you would win.

 

[jumper]

Heck they never even heard of it.

If it wasn't for this forum, I would not know about it. I have never seen it myself.

 

[Volta]

If it wasn't for this forum, I would not know about it. I have never seen it myself.

One of our distributors carried them for a while, I bought a roll each of 12 and 14. Each cost more than double a roll of either as 2-wire. Less copper too, five strands instead of six. Frustrating, I'd love to stock it.

 

[jumper]

I suppose one could argue that a branch-circuit that serves only lighting loads is not subject to sub-section 404.2(C) anyhow. Just don't feed receptacles or other directly-wired appliances.

Branch Circuit, General-Purpose. A branch circuit that
supplies two or more receptacles or outlets for lighting and
appliances.

Wow, good one. I ran it by my wife (an English major) and your are correct.:thumbsup:

'Course the inspector is gonna red tag you.

 

[Volta]

'Course the inspector is gonna red tag you.

I know, I know.