What exactly are the "instructions included with the listing or labeling"

[iceworm]

I'm caught up with an issue of is it okay to stand on a cable tray to perform a maintenance task - like say change a light bulb above the tray.

My first response: "Uh, well, No. There is a warning label on the tray that says, 'Do not use tray for personnel support'. "

Response: "For the past 30 years we have been putting a piece of plywood over that section of tray, climbing up on the plywood, and changing the light bulb. The tray has been holding us fine."

So, I estimate the weight of the cables in the tray, measure the distance between the supports, and do a structural calc. The tray will easily support an additional 250 lb point load with a 2.5 safety factor. Hummm - now what

Guiding regulation is (2008) 110.3.B.

Listed or labeled equipment shall be installed and used in accordance with any instructions including in the listing or labeling"​

I look up "Listed", "Labeled" (art 100), cable tray in the UL White book (CYNW)

Cable tray is "Classified". I did not find a standard. It is listed: http://database.ul.com/cgi-bin/XYV/cgifind.new/LISEXT/1FRAME/srchres.html?begin=10&collection=/data3/verity_collections/lisext&vdkhome=/usr/app/verity_sw_rev24/common&query=CYNW%3CIN%3ECCN+and+not+GUIDEINFO&SORT_BY=textlines:asc,ccnshorttitle:asc

Here is the guide info: http://database.ul.com/cgi-bin/XYV/template/LISEXT/1FRAME/showpage.html?&name=CYNW.GuideInfo&ccnshorttitle=Cable+Trays&objid=1074080954&cfgid=1073741824&version=versionless&parent_id=1073985303&sequence=1

The only thing discussed is the bonding between sections:

"Cable-tray assemblies have been investigated for bonding between sections using the minimum hardware provided by the manufacturer ..."​

For a comparison, if one were to look at the White book entry right above the one for cable tray, CYMX, Cable sealing fittings for use in hazardous locations, there are several references to look at the manufacturer's instructions included with the fitting. And there is a Ul standard referenced. In the CYNW entry, similar references to "manufacturer's instructions" are conspicuously absent. And there is no UL standard referenced either.

I did a Forum search on "listing + instructions:
http://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?t=140731&highlight=listing+instructions
Don's comment in post 8 seems to fit.

So finally, the questions:
What exactly are the "instructions included with the listing or labeling"
What exactly does "classified" mean?

Yesterday I would have thought they were the instructions that came in the box with the equipment. Today - maybe I don't know.

Where am I going with this?
In general, I don't like the idea of standing on a plywood cover on a cable tray - me thinking that makes it neither unsafe or illegal.

In this particular case the tray contains low voltage instrument cables. The area is tight to where building a scaffold is a multiple day affair. I can do a structural calc showing an adequate safety factor.

So the Osha/AHJ rep comes in and sees the crew standing on a plywood cover over the tray, right above where a bright red label says, "WARNING - DO NOT USE AS PERSONNEL SUPPORT". How do I explain this is okay - with out turning red-in-the-face, mumbling, and eyes downcast.

"Ahhh ... Here is the load calc showing it will hold the load. There is nothing in the White book saying we must heed the mfg instructions other than about bonding. The plywood is secured so it won't slip".:ashamed1:​

I don't know if the response would be:

"*&^%$^#@$$ Morons" as she turns away.:happysad:​

or

"Here's your citation"​

I'm interested in references, thoughts, opinions

the worm (continuing the search for wisdom and knowledge)

 

[iwire]

Move the light.

 

[roger]

I don't know if the response would be:

"*&^%$^#@$$ Morons" as she turns away.:happysad:​

or

"Here's your citation"​

I'm interested in references, thoughts, opinions

the worm (continuing the search for wisdom and knowledge)

I would say there is good chance that you would get both. :happyyes:

Roger

 

[nakulak]

Although you may have been very thorough in your calculation of the structural loads imposed by the live loading of the cable tray, the entire argument as to whether or not it should be used to support a live load of personnel is flawed. The question is: what do you gain by using the cable tray to support something it was not intended to support ? Answer: you gain the liability that, when someone falls off of the cable tray, the company, property owner, and perhaps yourself will be sued by their attorney or their insurance company for negligence. They can easily prove that the cable tray was not intended for the use. The secondary question becomes: Does the company, yourself, and the property owner stand to gain more from not taking steps to mitigate this liability than for the liability itself. IMO the liability far exceeds the mitigation of the problem (moving the light, getting a tool to change the lightbulb, buying a scaffold/ladder for the purpose, etc.).

 

[iceworm]

I would say there is good chance that you would get both. :happyyes:

Yes

Move the light

Good idea. But For other reasons we are stuck with the position.

... the entire argument as to whether or not it should be used to support a live load of personnel is flawed. ...

I just hate it when I have flawed arguments:ashamed1:

Seriously - all good points and true.

However, I'm still interested in:

... So finally, the questions:
What exactly are the "instructions included with the listing or labeling"
What exactly does "classified" mean?
...

 

[kwired]

Move the light.

But don't stand on the cable tray when doing so

 

[iceworm]

I was hoping someone had some clues as to:

What exactly are the "instructions included with the listing or labeling"
What exactly does "classified" mean?

Guess not. Still, I did enjoy the break - thanks for that.

Back to work for me.

later

 

[rbalex]

Start with the ULWhitebook. It contains most (but not necessarily all) of the “instructions included with the listing or labeling” in the various Category Codes. Where appropriate,it usually refers to instructions supplied by manufacturers as well. Also be careful to read the various “general” Category Codes, such as AALZ.

The Whitebook explains most of UL’s various marking schemes as well. “Classified” means the product is not listed but has been investigated for a specific purpose. In the case of cable trays, it means it has been reviewed as an equipment grounding conductor.

 

[rbalex]

BTW, the Category Code for metal cable trays is CYNW and nonmetallic is CYOV.

I should add that "Classified" may mean listed within the context of a third party certification, it just isn't "UL Listed."

 

[iceworm]

I appreciate you took time to respond.

. It (the White Book) contains most (but not necessarily all) of the ?instructions included with the listing or labeling? in the various Category Codes. Where appropriate,it usually refers to instructions supplied by manufacturers as well. ...

Yes, I have the same conclusion. As I noted in the OP, there are no references to the MFG instructions in CYNW or in the guide information (there is a link in the OP). So the only instructions would be those in CYNW and AALZ. Neither of which prohibit standing on a cable tray. I don't think I could ever get an AHJ or OSHA rep to agree the mfg instructions to not stand on the tray don't count - especially the OSHA rep would likely want to see a proper walking/working surface.

This issue is moot anyway. my direction to the crew is, "It says, 'Dont walk on it", so don't. There is no way we have a justifible position - even if it might be legally okay. I'm not willing to argue that it is okay."


the worm

 

[iceworm]

Again, I appreciate you took time to respond.

I'm still having trouble with clearly understanding Classified and Listed. You suggested I start with the White Book. Great idea. But as I noted in the OP - I did.

Start with the ULWhitebook. ...

As I carefully noted in the OP, the White book is exactly where I started.

...Guiding regulation is (2008) 110.3.B.
Listed or labeled equipment shall be installed and used in accordance with any instructions including in the listing or labeling"
I look up "Listed", "Labeled" (art 100), cable tray in the UL White book (CYNW) ...

In particular I read 2008 White book Introduction (pages 33-40), the section on CYNW, and section AALZ as referenced under Additional Information in CYNW. I also read White Book, UL Online Certifications Directory Quick Guide (11 pages) at the end of Appendix D. And I listed two links showing the additional UL guide information on CYNW.

I have pretty well run that one out. But then again, maybe I missed something.

..The Whitebook explains most of UL?s various marking schemes as well. ?Classified? means the product is not listed but has been investigated for a specific purpose. ...

This is one of the areas where I am not understanding. Here's why:
Art 100, Listed:
Equipment, materials, or services included in a list
published by an organization that is acceptable to the authority
having jurisdiction ...

And, of course you saw this link in the OP: http://database.ul.com/cgi-bin/XYV/cgifind.new/LISEXT/1FRAME/srchres.html?begin=10&collection=/data3/verity_collections/lisext&vdkhome=/usr/app/verity_sw_rev24/common&query=CYNW%3CIN%3ECCN+and+not+GUIDEINFO&SORT_BY=textlines:asc,ccnshorttitle:asc

And that certainly appears to meed the NEC definition of "Listed"

And it appears to meet the definition of Listed in the White Book, page 34. Unless this is the part I'm missing.

Is there some where one can look at this List?

the worm

 

[rbalex]

You might want to consider the INSTRUCTIONS AND PRODUCT MARKINGS Section in AALZ:

These products are intended to be installed in accordance with the
installation instructions provided with the product. It is critical that the
cautionary statements and installation and operating instructions on the
product and in accompanying literature be followed.

As I mentioned in Post 9,'... "Classified" may mean listed within the context of a third party certification, it just isn't "UL Listed."'

 

[bphgravity]

OSHA regulations are what require certain equipment and materials to be one or more of the following:

Accepted, Approved, Certified, Classified, Listed, Labaled, Meet the requirements of, Otherwise determined to be safe, Tested and approved, Tested and listed

Installation & product use instructions are outlined in the product standard. Those instructions are then provided to the user via labels, markings, installation instructions, specifications sheets, etc.

For example, this is from ANSI/UL 1081 (Standard For Safety For Swimming Pool Pumps, Filters, and Chlorinators)"

52.5 Unless otherwise indicated, the instructions shall be in the exact words specified or shall be in equally definitive terminology to the following items. No substitutes shall be used for the words "WARNING" and "CAUTION ." The items may be numbered. The first and last items specified below shall be first and last respectively. Other important and precautionary items determined appropriate by the manufacturer may be inserted. Notes to the manufacturer are in parentheses.

IMPORTANT SAFETY INSTRUCTIONS

When installing and using this electrical equipment, basic safety precautions should always be followed, including the following:

1) READ AND FOLLOW ALL INSTRUCTIONS

2) (For all units) WARNING - To reduce the risk of injury, do not permit children to use this product unless they are closely supervised at all times.

3) (For storable pool pumps) WARNING - Risk of Electric Shock. Connect only to a grounding type receptacle. This product is provided with a ground-fault circuit-interrupter. If replacement of the plug or cord is needed, use only identical replacement parts.

4) (For all permanently-installed units intended for use on 15 or 20 ampere, 125 volt or 240 volt, single phase branch circuits) WARNING - Risk of Electric Shock. Connect only to a branch circuit protected by a ground-fault circuit-interrupter (GFCI). Contact a qualified electrician if you cannot verify that the circuit is protected by a GFCI.

5) Deleted March 31, 2010.

6) Deleted March 31, 2010.

7) (For all permanently installed units intended for use on 15 or 20 ampere, 125 volt or 240 volt, single phase branch circuits) The unit must be connected only to a supply circuit that is protected by a ground-fault circuit-interrupter (GFCI). Such a GFCI should be provided by the installer and should be tested on a routine basis. To test the GFCI, push the test button. The GFCI should interrupt power. Push the reset button. Power should be restored. If the GFCI fails to operate in this manner, the GFCI is defective. If the GFCI interrupts power to the pump without the test button being pushed, a ground current is flowing, indicating the possibility of an electric shock. Do not use this pump. Disconnect the pump and have the problem corrected by a qualified service representative before using.

8) (For storable pool pumps) The unit is provided with a ground-fault circuit-interrupter (GFCI). To test the GFCI, push the test button. The GFCI should interrupt power. Push the reset button. Power should be restored. If the GFCI fails to operate in this manner, the GFCI is defective. If the GFCI interrupts power to the pump without the test button being pushed, a ground current is flowing, indicating the possibility of an electric shock. Do not use this pump. Disconnect the pump and have the problem corrected by a qualified service representative before using.

9) (For units intended for above-ground storable swimming pools) Do not bury cord. Locate cord to minimize abuse from lawn mowers, hedge trimmers, and other equipment.

10) (For all cord- and plug-connected units) WARNING - To reduce the risk of electric shock, replace damaged cord immediately.

11) (For units intended for above-ground storable swimming pools) WARNING - To reduce the risk of electric shock, do not use extension cord to connect unit to electric supply; provide a properly located outlet.

12) (For units intended for above-ground storable swimming pools) CAUTION - This pump is for use with storable pools only. Do not use with permanently-installed pools. A storable pool is constructed so that it is capable of being readily disassembled for storage and reassembled to its original integrity. A permanently-installed pool is constructed in or on the ground or in a building such that it cannot be readily disassembled for storage.

13) (For swimming pool pumps intended for use with permanent swimming pools or spas) CAUTION - This pump is for use with permanently-installed pools and may also be used with hot tubs and spas if so marked. Do not use with storable pools. A permanently-installed pool is constructed in or on the ground or in a building such that it cannot be readily disassembled for storage. A storable pool is constructed so that it is capable of being readily disassembled for storage and reassembled to its original integrity.

14) (For hot tub and spa pumps) Do not install within an outer enclosure or beneath the skirt of a hot tub or spa.

15) SAVE THESE INSTRUCTIONS.


Items 4 - 7 revised March 31, 2010. Items 9 - 14 revised May 28, 2009. Revised item 3 and added items 4, 7, and 8 effective May 28, 2011.

Lisitng & Classification are two methods for testing and certifying equipment and materials.

Classification is:

A service whereby UL determines that a manufacturer has demonstrated the ability to produce a product that complies with UL's requirements for the purpose of classification or evaluation with respect to one or more of the following: (1) specific risks only, e.g., casualty, fire or shock, (2) performance under specified conditions, (3) regulatory codes, (4) other standards, including international standards, or (5) such other conditions as UL may consider desirable. By terms UL's Service Agreement, UL authorizes the manufacturer to use the Classification Mark on products that comply with UL's requirements and establishes Follow-Up Service as a check of the means the manufacturer exercises to maintain compliance with the requirements of UL.

Listing is:

A service whereby UL determines that a manufacturer has demonstrated the ability to produce a product that complies with UL's requirements with respect to reasonably foreseeable risks associated with the product. As part of the service, by the terms of UL's Service Agreement, UL authorizes the manufacturer to use the UL Listing Mark on products that comply with UL's requirements and establishes Follow-Up Service conducted by UL as a check of the means the manufacturer exercises to determine compliance with UL's requirements.

 

[iceworm]

You might want to consider the INSTRUCTIONS AND PRODUCT MARKINGS Section in AALZ: ...

Yes, thanks - that's the piece I missed.