Breaker or no breaker?

[mark32]

A customer wants a manual transfer switch for their portable generator. I haven't yet looked at the job but the owner says the main panel is on the first floor that then feeds a sub in the basement, which houses all the circuits they want on the generator. Owner claims there's no space to mount the gen panel next to the sub so the gen panel needs to be upstairs next to the main panel. I was thinking about taking the sub feed out of the main panel and putting it in the gen panel and terminate it's ungrounded conductors to the panel's main lugs instead of a breaker. So in this generator panel there would be two back fed dbl pole breakers only, one for the utility and one for the generator. Do you see any code issues with this?

 

[mbednarik]

Make sure you route the grounded with the ungrounded conductors, no i don't see a problem with it.

 

[ceb58]

If you do that you will need an interlock on those breakers. Why not install a double pole transfer switch, there is no need for OCP there since the main has the breaker for the sub panel and the gen has a breaker.

 

[Sierrasparky]

A customer wants a manual transfer switch for their portable generator. I haven't yet looked at the job but the owner says the main panel is on the first floor that then feeds a sub in the basement, which houses all the circuits they want on the generator. Owner claims there's no space to mount the gen panel next to the sub so the gen panel needs to be upstairs next to the main panel. I was thinking about taking the sub feed out of the main panel and putting it in the gen panel and terminate it's ungrounded conductors to the panel's main lugs instead of a breaker. So in this generator panel there would be two back fed dbl pole breakers only, one for the utility and one for the generator. Do you see any code issues with this?

How were you planning on preventing the main panel from back-feed of the generator.

I would purchase a manual transfer switch and do it right.

 

[mark32]

Yes yes, the panel in question is a generator panel/manual transfer switch that comes with 2 double poles and an interlock, I should have stated that originally, you can see it here if you like:

http://www.homedepot.com/buy/electr...-4-space-8-circuit-generator-panel-98664.html


My question had to do with providing a breaker for the basement sub panel or just terminating it's feeder right to the lugs of the transfer switch. It would work, it just seems like an uncommon way to hook it up, at least to me. Again, I'm talking about removing the sub's feeder from the main panel (either entirely or extending it to the new panel) and re-feeding it from the generator panel/transfer switch's lugs, no separate breaker.

 

[bradleyelectric]

. I was thinking about taking the sub feed out of the main panel and putting it in the gen panel and terminate it's ungrounded conductors to the panel's main lugs instead of a breaker. So in this generator panel there would be two back fed dbl pole breakers only, one for the utility and one for the generator. Do you see any code issues with this?

Why not make the existing sub panel the gen panel with the backfed breakers like you said and put an interlock kit on those breakers, you can either buy the breakers and interlock for the existing panel depending on the manufacturer or change the existing panel. Square D sells the parts to make the panel in your post individually so you can install them in any size panel you want.

 

[mark32]

Hmmm, that's a good idea Bradley. It would depend on which panel would be easier to get the generator feed to. I'll look into that, thanks!

 

[kwired]

I like your original idea best. Remember if you back feed a breaker in a panel it must have some kind of retainer so the breaker can not be removed with a simple pull. If it is a dwelling it is not likely to be bolt on breakers. Most retainer kits only work on certain positions in the panel. I did not look at your link but from your description it likely has everything needed and will probably be easiest.

 

[mark32]

kwired, you are correct indeed, the panel I linked to does come with the hold downs for the to-be-backfed breakers already installed. It would be a simpler install as you said considering this little gen panel has everything included in one package.