Should I re-pull this?

Status
Not open for further replies.
mark32

mark32

Senior Member
Location
Currently in NJ
Keen members may see my last few threads have dealt with the same install I've been tinkering with when time permits, that being a standby generator. On the night I glanced over the gen and transfer switch I was in a hurry, I tried identifying the conductors in the factory whip that would run from the gen to ts. I couldn't get a good look at it as it was still in it's shipping packaging but I did see #4's in the much shorter whip that connects the ts to the main panel. The reason I needed such info is because I had to extend the 30' factory whip (TS to gen). So what I have is: EMT from the ts to splice box 30' away, factory FMC whip (Removed from ts) from spice box (Through a crawl space) to another spice box outside, PVC underground from spice box to factory gen splice box. I pulled in the #4's along with the control wires to the first splice box and notice that there are #6's in the 30' factory whip and not #4's as I has ASSumed!! I of course felt stupid but now my concern is I've gone up a size on the ungrounded conductors. (The gen has it's own 65a breaker) I thought about going up on the EGC from a #8 to a #6 but the factory whip (#8 EGC) is sandwiched in between my two runs so that wouldn't serve much purpose. I'm unsure if the inspector would catch this goof and if he did would he really make me swap out the #4's for #6's? I'd like to leave it but at the same time if I had to re-pull I'd rather do it now before I cut the #4's as I could at least sell it to another contractor at a discount.
 
Last edited:
mark32 said:
Keen members may see my last few threads have dealt with the same install I've been tinkering with when time permits, that being a standby generator. On the night I glanced over the gen and transfer switch I was in a hurry, I tried identifying the conductors in the factory whip that would run from the gen to ts. I couldn't get a good look at it as it was still in it's shipping packaging but I did see #4's in the much shorter whip that connects the ts to the main panel. The reason I needed such info is because I had to extend the 30' factory whip (TS to gen). So what I have is: EMT from the ts to splice box 30' away, factory FMC whip (Removed from ts) from spice box (Through a crawl space) to another spice box outside, PVC underground from spice box to factory gen splice box. I pulled in the #4's along with the control wires to the first splice box and notice that there are #6's in the 30' factory whip and not #4's as I has ASSumed!! I of course felt stupid but now my concern is I've gone up a size on the ungrounded conductors. (The gen has it's own 65a breaker) I thought about going up on the EGC from a #8 to a #6 but the factory whip (#8 EGC) is sandwiched in between my two runs so that wouldn't serve much purpose. I'm unsure if the inspector would catch this goof and if he did would he really make me swap out the #4's for #6's? I'd like to leave it but at the same time if I had to re-pull I'd rather do it now before I cut the #4's as I could at least sell it to another contractor at a discount.
Click to expand...

I don't see how going up a size would be an issue if you sized the EGC that run with the #4's properly.

If you are not sure about what the inspector would say, why not call him/her and explain the situation and get their take on it before you do any destruction?
 
mark32 said:
Hey k8mhz, so you want me to do the logical thing and call the inspector :) Just to be clear, my concern lies with a recent topic that you and others discussed previously here: http://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?t=141925&p=1359533#post1359533 and that being with 250.122(b)
Click to expand...

Is your concern that you would have to upsize the ECG for the entire circuit, including the #6 run?

I would say no, that if the EGC in the #4 run was sized for #4, and the ECG in the #6 run was sized for #6, there would not be a violation and the intent of the code would be satisfied. Think of it this way, you run a #8 on a 20 amp circuit to a receptacle for voltage drop. When you get to the receptacle you can splice #12 pigtails to the receptacles and a #12 EGC from the receptacle to the #8 splice is not only fine, but a #8 won't fit in the terminals anyway. I am pretty sure that the upsized ECG only has to be as long as the upsized ungrounded conductors.

Still, I would call the AHJ first. Hopefully he will say there is no problem and will be glad you called for clarification before he got there for inspection. That's the way it works around here, anyway.
 
Last edited:
K8MHZ said:
Is your concern that you would have to upsize the ECG for the entire circuit, including the #6 run?

I would say no, that if the EGC in the #4 run was sized for #4, and the ECG in the #6 run was sized for #6, there would not be a violation and the intent of the code would be satisfied. Think of it this way, you run a #8 on a 20 amp circuit to a receptacle for voltage drop. When you get to the receptacle you can splice #12 pigtails to the receptacles and a #12 EGC from the receptacle to the #8 splice is not only fine, but a #8 won't fit in the terminals anyway. I am pretty sure that the upsized ECG only has to be as long as the upsized ungrounded conductors.

Still, I would call the AHJ first. Hopefully he will say there is no problem and will be glad you called for clarification before he got there for inspection. That's the way it works around here, anyway.
Click to expand...

Or....... You sized for the 65 amp as you should have, and the manufacture wired their machine and whip as they determined........
Have you ever brought 30 or 40 amp circuits over to equipment because that was the load on the name plate and or specs you where given. Then the machine is installed and completely wired with 14's or 12's??? Personally, I think you done good mark......:thumbsup:
 
K8MHZ, I like the way you're looking at this, clearly I didn't think along the same lines and I thank you for your take on this article.

ritelec, thank you for the kind words, I'll post some pics when I finish the job.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top