box accesability

plumb bob · Jul 16, 2012

Looking for opinions on an install. Hard lid ceiling in a bathroom with two 2x4 fluorescent lights. CMU walls that extend all the way to the roof deck, basically leaving no access above the ceiling from inside or outside the room. Okay to set a box above the fixtures? I guess I am basically asking if a box is considered accessible if a fixture has to be totally removed from the ceiling to access it. Also, would it sway your opinion if the box feeds the lights? I feel the box would not be considered accessible, whether it is feeding the light or if it was just a pull box for a totally different circuit. Anyone else? :?

Ponchik · Jul 16, 2012

If i am understanding your question correctly then here is my comment:

That is how most of the wiring is done. Isn't it? you pull the wire, install the box and the fixture goes over the box. Perfectly fine installation.

plumb bob · Jul 16, 2012

I'm sorry, bad description. Standard 4 square mounted to some structural steel with a whip to the light.

ActionDave · Jul 16, 2012

plumb bob said:
I'm sorry, bad description. Standard 4 square mounted to some structural steel with a whip to the light.

No. Not accessible.

infinity · Jul 16, 2012

Boxes above the ceiling and adjacent to recessed florescent fixtures are fine IMO. They have been installed that way for as long as flourescent fixtures have been made.

ActionDave · Jul 16, 2012

The words "2x4 fluorescent lights" and "4 square mounted to some structural steel with a whip to the light" lead me to believe there is some distance between the box and the light.

John120/240 · Jul 16, 2012

ActionDave said:
The words "2x4 fluorescent lights" and "4 square mounted to some structural steel with a whip to the light" lead me to believe there is some distance between the box and the light.

Just to play Devil's Advocate; The box is accessible once you remove the 2 X 4 luminare.

billdozier 78 · Jul 16, 2012

Can you pipe directly into the fixture? Or does the box contain other circuits thus making the light a raceway?

ActionDave · Jul 16, 2012

John120/240 said:
Just to play Devil's Advocate; The box is accessible once you remove the 2 X 4 luminare.

Sure, if there were an acess panel behind the light.

John120/240 · Jul 16, 2012

John120/240 said:
Just to play Devil's Advocate; The box is accessible once you remove the 2 X 4 luminare.

ActionDave said:
Sure, if there were an acess panel behind the light.

From the OP I assumed that removeing the luminare gives you access to the space above

example attic

ActionDave · Jul 17, 2012

John120/240 said:
plumb bob said:

From the OP I assumed that removeing the luminare gives you access to the space above

example attic

Click to expand...

Looking for opinions on an install. Hard lid ceiling in a bathroom with two 2x4 fluorescent lights. CMU walls that extend all the way to the roof deck, basically leaving no access above the ceiling from inside or outside the room. Okay to set a box above the fixtures? I guess I am basically asking if a box is considered accessible if a fixture has to be totally removed from the ceiling to access it. Also, would it sway your opinion if the box feeds the lights? I feel the box would not be considered accessible, whether it is feeding the light or if it was just a pull box for a totally different circuit. Anyone else? :?

Okay. I am seeing a fixture surface mounted to the drywall. If there is a hole under it big enough to reach up through and get to the box without messing up the ceiling, then yes- accessible. But it would have to be about 23 1/2 inches wide by 30 inches long.

jumper · Jul 17, 2012

ActionDave said:
Okay. I am seeing a fixture surface mounted to the drywall. If there is a hole under it big enough to reach up through and get to the box without messing up the ceiling, then yes- accessible. But it would have to be about 23 1/2 inches wide by 30 inches long.

Dave, how much room do you have to access a recessed fixture box after installation?

ActionDave · Jul 17, 2012

Four to six inches, but the box is right there, not out of reach beyound my hands. I think the OP has a greater distance in mind since he mentions a fixture whip.

jumper · Jul 17, 2012

ActionDave said:
Four to six inches, but the box is right there, not out of reach beyound my hands. I think the OP has a greater distance in mind since he mentions a fixture whip.

Good point.

infinity · Jul 17, 2012

John120/240 said:
Just to play Devil's Advocate; The box is accessible once you remove the 2 X 4 luminare.

Isn't that good enough? He said in the OP that removing the fixture will access the box above.

plumb bob · Jul 17, 2012

John120/240 said:
From the OP I assumed that removeing the luminare gives you access to the space above

example attic

Yes, this is the scenario. By removing the light you could access the box. The box was supported indepandent of the light, and the installer had left enough slack in the MC whip to drop the light about 3 feet below the hole. Crew was divided on whether we felt it was code compliant or not. I said no way, some guys said no problem, others thought it was okay as long as only the lighting circuit was in the box and no other circuits. An inspector passed it once, we shall see if he does again, the ceiling was opened for some plumbing renovations but will probably still be open when we have inspections in ajacent areas!

infinity · Jul 17, 2012

plumb bob said:
Yes, this is the scenario. By removing the light you could access the box. The box was supported indepandent of the light, and the installer had left enough slack in the MC whip to drop the light about 3 feet below the hole. Crew was divided on whether we felt it was code compliant or not. I said no way, some guys said no problem, others thought it was okay as long as only the lighting circuit was in the box and no other circuits. An inspector passed it once, we shall see if he does again, the ceiling was opened for some plumbing renovations but will probably still be open when we have inspections in ajacent areas!

What code section would you cite?

Dennis Alwon · Jul 17, 2012

I assume this is a recessed fluorescent light install in a sheetrock ceiling. Is that the case. If so then I think the install is fine.

ActionDave · Jul 17, 2012

plumb bob said:
Yes, this is the scenario. By removing the light you could access the box. The box was supported indepandent of the light, and the installer had left enough slack in the MC whip to drop the light about 3 feet below the hole. Crew was divided on whether we felt it was code compliant or not. I said no way, some guys said no problem, others thought it was okay as long as only the lighting circuit was in the box and no other circuits. An inspector passed it once, we shall see if he does again, the ceiling was opened for some plumbing renovations but will probably still be open when we have inspections in ajacent areas!

Well, that is not what I had in mind at all. I take back every thing I said.

Not everything. I did say if the access was big enough then it would be okay.

plumb bob · Jul 17, 2012

infinity said:
What code section would you cite?

314.29--- but now i feel like I'm on the spot :ashamed1:

I guess i see the fixture "as part of the building" and the box not accessible since you must remove it (the light) to get at the 4 square and whip.
Perhaps I should rethink this?

box accesability

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