Machine manufacturer, Covered under NEC ??

[milmat1]

Hello,

I have a question that may seem out of the norm, We are a custom machine manufacturer. We design and build custom machines for several industries.

I have been told by our engineering manager that the electrical system of our machines are not covered or governed by the NEC because we build an engineered product.

My question is if this is the case then who does govern this ? Are we self governing just because we build an engineered product?

I know many of the things we do are not to "Code" per say.

 

[GoldDigger]

Hello,

I have a question that may seem out of the norm, We are a custom machine manufacturer. We design and build custom machines for several industries.

I have been told by our engineering manager that the electrical system of our machines are not covered or governed by the NEC because we build an engineered product.

My question is if this is the case then who does govern this ? Are we self governing just because we build an engineered product?

I know many of the things we do are not to "Code" per say.

If your machinery is not of a type required to have UL listing, then your main concern with the NEC is providing the correct terminals, cords, and instructions for attaching your machinery to the power system, in a manner which is governed by the NEC.
If your machinery requires UL-listing, then the rules you have to follow are the applicable UL standards and not the NEC.

If no standards specifically, under law, apply to your product then you are governed by normal liability and commercial law, which may include following good engineering practices.
If you product walks, talks and quacks like a product for which a UL-listing standard is mandatory, then you cannot simply "engineer" yourself out of that requirement.

 

[ASTERIX]

NEC code is Religion ???

NEC code is Religion ???

Hello,

I have a question that may seem out of the norm, We are a custom machine manufacturer. We design and build custom machines for several industries.

I have been told by our engineering manager that the electrical system of our machines are not covered or governed by the NEC because we build an engineered product.

My question is if this is the case then who does govern this ? Are we self governing just because we build an engineered product?

I know many of the things we do are not to "Code" per say.

If you build custom machinery controls, your customer may or may not require a UL label stuck on the inside of the box. Most of the control equipment components going into today's machine control panels are imported. Most of the imported equipment from non-us suppliers has a UL or UR label. If the component is unique (or low volume export to the US) the maker will not spring for the exorbitant UL testing fees. If such part comes from Europe, it will have a VDE or CE mark which is more stringed than UL.

Take a look at the back of your Monitor: Notice the increased size of the manuf. sticker now having labels of all the world's testing agencies on it ?
Looks like racket ! (or parasitic enterprise)

 

[milmat1]

Thank you for the replies. We do not sell a UL listed machine however all the components going into the machine are usually UL listed. I use Hoffman cabinets of the NEMA rating for the application etc.
I do risk assessment and always maintain a cat 3 safety stop system as well..

Thanks Again for the replies

 

[texie]

Thank you for the replies. We do not sell a UL listed machine however all the components going into the machine are usually UL listed. I use Hoffman cabinets of the NEMA rating for the application etc.
I do risk assessment and always maintain a cat 3 safety stop system as well..

Thanks Again for the replies

Many state and local AHJ's have a requirement that equipment be listed by a nationally recognized testing laboratory (NRTL). I'm amazed that this has not been an issue for you. The fact that you use recognized components would not mean anything to many AHJ's.

 

[weressl]

Hello,

I have a question that may seem out of the norm, We are a custom machine manufacturer. We design and build custom machines for several industries.

I have been told by our engineering manager that the electrical system of our machines are not covered or governed by the NEC because we build an engineered product.

My question is if this is the case then who does govern this ? Are we self governing just because we build an engineered product?

I know many of the things we do are not to "Code" per say.

That would be UL 508 Standard. Anything that uses electricity, eg. connected to an electrical supply has to be suitable for it, so at least the power supply connection point does fall under the purview of NEC. (IMO of course.)

 

[Timbert]

You may not be covered by the NEC, but what national consensus standard does your engineering manager tell you to follow? As GoldDigger points out if not covered by the NEC the law will look to see if you followed good engineering practice and if you didn't follow a standard...opposing council will be very happy. Will following a standard keep you or your company from getting sued, of course not, but it definitely makes it tougher for the opposing council to prove you didn't follow good engineering practice when you can point to a recognized standard.

You said you use Cat. 3 safety stops. Which implies EN 954-1 which was withdrawn and replaced with ISO 13849-1. So, you should be talking about PL (or it could be you're simply still stuck talking with the old lingo).

I would definitely cover my own backside and ask the engineering manager what voluntary standard is to be followed. In the US, while NFPA 79 is not the law, OSHA will cite it when they inspect your customers that use the equipment you produce. If you follow NFPA 79, I'd point out that means you are still (partially) covered by the NEC, as NFPA 79 specifically says points not covered by it, shall follow the NEC.

This all creates a tangled mess. We all know of parts of the code, that while good intentioned, don't necessarily make sense in all cases. Some people are more risk-adverse than others. The bottom line is, are you uncomfortable with what you are seeing done?