swapping out residential panel

[flywright52]

I will be swapping out an old 200 amp FP residential panel for a customer in a couple of weeks. I believe this will be a panel-only swap since the entrance cable is in good condition and long enough for a new panel. Since this is my first solo swap, I thought I would ask the experts for some advice.
1. Do you normally mount the new panel on treated plywood? Current panel is mounted directly to the concrete wall. I've seen both installations in our area.
2. How do you provide temporary power? I will be working in a basement and will need lights and power for the hammer drill.

 

[ActionDave]

I
1. Do you normally mount the new panel on treated plywood?

No.

2. How do you provide temporary power? I will be working in a basement and will need lights and power for the hammer drill.

Generator.

 

[macmikeman]

99% of the ones I do, and that is lots, are flush in walls. Yours should be a snap being mounted to a wall unless perhaps there is lots of conduits involved. If it is all cables you should be in and out in a few hours.

 

[K8MHZ]

In Michigan we can't mount to concrete, we must use pressure treated lumber.

For electricity it's battery power all day. We have battery everything.

If you are going from a smaller panel to a 200, the entrance conductors and meter socket have to be rated for at least 200 amps. You can't leave #4 AWG in the mast or cable coming to the meter with a 200 amp OCPD.

 

[K8MHZ]

99% of the ones I do, and that is lots, are flush in walls. Yours should be a snap being mounted to a wall unless perhaps there is lots of conduits involved. If it is all cables you should be in and out in a few hours.

I think that depends on location. 90 percent of the ones we do are in basements, mounted on the block wall. If you live in an area that doesn't have basements, then the way you do it would be prevalent.

On occasion we get to do flush mounts where real 2 x 4's were used and the space between the studs is 1/2" too narrow. No fun at all carving out real oak studs.

 

[growler]

1. Do you normally mount the new panel on treated plywood? Current panel is mounted directly to the concrete wall. I've seen both installations in our area.
2. How do you provide temporary power? I will be working in a basement and will need lights and power for the hammer drill.

I actually use 3/4" pressure treated plywood with a 1/4" regular plywood on top of that so the panel doesn't come in contact with the pressure treated.

For temp power a generator is good if the neighbors don't mind the noise. I also have a small temp power panel on a piece of plywood that I can hook up at the meter.

 

[480sparky]

I actually use 3/4" pressure treated plywood with a 1/4" regular plywood on top of that so the panel doesn't come in contact with the pressure treated.

For temp power a generator is good if the neighbors don't mind the noise. I also have a small temp power panel on a piece of plywood that I can hook up at the meter.

The neighbors might be good for temp power as well. Just be sure to ask first.

 

[K8MHZ]

The neighbors might be good for temp power as well. Just be sure to ask first.

What? Nobody is set up with battery powered devices?

We haven't used 120 VAC on service upgrades in years. All our equipment and lights are battery powered. We save at least an hour per job by not having to screw around with generators or scabbing 120 from somewhere, plus we don't have to drag and trip over extension cords and fix them when they fail.

 

[K8MHZ]

If we absolutely have to have 120 VAC at the site, we just scab off the drop with a GFCI. For a while the POCO wouldn't let us due to a contractor stealing electricity big time, but now they don't care.

We got so set up and used to battery everything that dragging out the scab drop and hooking it up is more of a PITA than it's worth.

 

[gaelectric]

I've got a 2K Honda that is light and quiet. First thing on the truck on service change day.

 

[flywright52]

If we absolutely have to have 120 VAC at the site, we just scab off the drop with a GFCI.

Sounds like a good backup plan. How do you connect to the line side of the meter base? Insulated clips?

 

[K8MHZ]

If we absolutely have to have 120 VAC at the site, we just scab off the drop with a GFCI.

Sounds like a good backup plan. How do you connect to the line side of the meter base? Insulated clips?

We connect to the triplex after it's been cut from the drop. If there is one. UG fed bases make things tricky and we never scabbed them as they would be dead from being clipped at the pole. We would use inverters or generators. It's so nice to be freed up from that part of the job, now that we use battery power 99 44/100 percent of the time.

Yes, clips are the easiest even for triplex. I have also seen people use big wire nuts. The set up is fairly barbaric, but works. 20 feet or so of NM into a plastic single gang box with a GFCI receptacle. The clips are nice, but not really required.

 

[flywright52]

Thanks everyone for the advice. I'm going to try all battery power for this swap since it should be simple (are there really any of those?)

 

[macmikeman]

I think that depends on location. 90 percent of the ones we do are in basements, mounted on the block wall. If you live in an area that doesn't have basements, then the way you do it would be prevalent.

On occasion we get to do flush mounts where real 2 x 4's were used and the space between the studs is 1/2" too narrow. No fun at all carving out real oak studs.

Oak Studs? Wow. All I ever saw used in my life was Georgia Pacific pine wood used for studs. You guys are lucky.

 

[growler]

Oak Studs? Wow. All I ever saw used in my life was Georgia Pacific pine wood used for studs. You guys are lucky.

I think he is talking about really old houses. You find oak studs in those old houses and they really are 2" X 4" dimentions. After about a 100 years those really are hard to cut. I have burned up drill bits just trying to drill holes.

 

[K8MHZ]

I think he is talking about really old houses. You find oak studs in those old houses and they really are 2" X 4" dimentions. After about a 100 years those really are hard to cut. I have burned up drill bits just trying to drill holes.

The last one I did was an apartment built in the 70's. I know that's when it was built because I live near it and remember seeing the complex going up.

 

[K8MHZ]

Oak Studs? Wow. All I ever saw used in my life was Georgia Pacific pine wood used for studs. You guys are lucky.

Obviously you have never worked with the old stuff. Lucky you say?

KNOT!



The stuff is nearly as hard as aluminum. Having to carve a 1/2" off both sides the depth of the panel really sucks. The new plunge cutters make it a bit easier, but there is still real wood carving to be done to get the panel to fit correctly.

 

[mopowr steve]

I've got a 2K Honda that is light and quiet. First thing on the truck on service change day.

Have a 2k Honda also. Quiet, plenty of power, bee's knees. Or use a scab gfi on the line when I can.

 

[macmikeman]

In old houses I work on the old wood does get hard as hell, but I don't think I ever ran across oak wood for framing before. I think most wood around my parts comes from the Northwest. I could see Oak used in the east though.

 

[peter d]

Oak was used to make lath that was used in America's building boom for decades.