250.148 Wording

[jap]

Why does the wording read "shall be connected (within) the box or (to) the box?

Seems this leaves an option not to have to connect to the box.

I know this has been discussed a lot, but it still doesnt make complete sense to me.

JAP>

 

[jumper]

You can connect all the EGCs together within the box, ie use a wire nut or you can connect them to the box, ie using grounding screws or clips.

Regardless of either method, or a combination of both, the box must be bonded.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

The wording is not the best but every metal box must be bonded somehow so the bonded to the box is not a yes or no choice. Even if EMT is used and an equipment grounding conductor is pulled then the box needs to be bonded to the equipment grounding conductor, IMO.

As Jumper stated you can connect all the equipment grounding conductor to the box via a ground bar or something similar.

 

[jap]

You can connect all the EGCs together within the box, ie use a wire nut or you can connect them to the box, ie using grounding screws or clips.

Regardless of either method, or a combination of both, the box must be bonded.

In the first sentence above the "OR" gives you an option not to have to connect to the box.

What rule requires the 2nd sentence above if you run EMT and pull a EGC in the conduit?

That's my dilema with this.

JAP>

 

[jap]

I agree with both of you, but, when trying to explain it to someone else the wording makes it very difficult to convince someone they have to bond to the box if you pull an EGC in, even if you've run EMT all the way back.

JAP>

 

[david luchini]

In the first sentence above the "OR" gives you an option not to have to connect to the box.

What rule requires the 2nd sentence above if you run EMT and pull a EGC in the conduit?

That's my dilema with this.

JAP>

If the sentence said "and" wouldn't that require you to connect to a non-metallic box?

You are ignoring the part of the sentence that says "in accordance with 250.148(A) through (E)."

See 240.148(C).

 

[iwire]

In the first sentence above the "OR" gives you an option not to have to connect to the box.

What rule requires the 2nd sentence above if you run EMT and pull a EGC in the conduit?

That's my dilema with this.

JAP>

250.148 requires it, bonding the box to the wire is not an option

 

[jap]

If the sentence said "and" wouldn't that require you to connect to a non-metallic box?

You are ignoring the part of the sentence that says "in accordance with 250.148(A) through (E)."

See 240.148(C).

Thanks,
JAP>

 

[iwire]

You are ignoring the part of the sentence that says "in accordance with 250.148(A) through (E)."

And perhaps the name off the section itself.

250.148 Continuity and Attachment of Equipment Grounding Conductors to Boxes. Where circuit conduc-tors are spliced within a box, or terminated on equipment within or supported by a box, any equipment grounding con-ductor(s) associated with those circuit conductors shall be con-nected within the box or to the box with devices suitable for the use in accordance with 250.148(A) through (E).

Exception: The equipment grounding conductor permitted in 250.146(D) shall not be required to be connected to the other equipment grounding conductors or to the box.

 

[jap]

And perhaps the name off the section itself.

250.148 Continuity and Attachment of Equipment Grounding Conductors to Boxes. Where circuit conduc-tors are spliced within a box, or terminated on equipment within or supported by a box, any equipment grounding con-ductor(s) associated with those circuit conductors shall be con-nected within the box or to the box with devices suitable for the use in accordance with 250.148(A) through (E).

Exception: The equipment grounding conductor permitted in 250.146(D) shall not be required to be connected to the other equipment grounding conductors or to the box.

It's still worded goofy.

They should have left the "within the box or" out of the sentence and added a sentence with some clarification.

........any equipment grounding con-ductor(s) associated with those circuit conductors shall be connected to the box with devices suitable for use...........

Where boxes used are non-conductive, the EGC's shall be connected within the box.


Just sayin,,,,


JAP>

 

[morepower]

morepower

morepower

If I understand 250.148 correctly, the ground(s) do not have to be spliced nor bonded to the box unless the circuit conductors are spliced or terminated to a device in the box. If all of the conductors are pulled straight through the box without terminating or splicing, no connection to the box or splicing is required.

 

[MasterTheNEC]

It's still worded goofy.

They should have left the "within the box or" out of the sentence and added a sentence with some clarification.

........any equipment grounding con-ductor(s) associated with those circuit conductors shall be connected to the box with devices suitable for use...........

Where boxes used are non-conductive, the EGC's shall be connected within the box.


Just sayin,,,,


JAP>

CMP 5 eagerly awaits your 2020 Public Input:angel:

 

[K8MHZ]

I must be missing something because the NEC article pretty much makes sense to me.

 

[K8MHZ]

If I understand 250.148 correctly, the ground(s) do not have to be spliced nor bonded to the box unless the circuit conductors are spliced or terminated to a device in the box. If all of the conductors are pulled straight through the box without terminating or splicing, no connection to the box or splicing is required.

That's how I understand it, too.

That doesn't prevent such a connection, it just doesn't require one, as a box with no splices is pretty much just a different shaped piece of conduit.