Why are meters mounted on the customer's premises?

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mbrooke

mbrooke

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Why don't POCOs just put the meter on the pole or in their equipment somewhere? Having un-metered power and who owns what is a recipe for problems and power theft.
 
And some meters are on the pole. CT metering is done at the pole many times.
its far too expensive and inaccurate for smaller loads like residential to CT meter every house.
 
Locating the meter at or close to the customer is really the only practical way to access the customer's service. I suppose you could locate the meter on the pole or pedestal where the service originates (and actually that is sometimes done) but that can get unwieldy fast if there is more than one customer/meter per pole or pedestal.

With the advent of remote meter reading I would like to see meters allowed to be located inside the customer's premises again. That would eliminate the deterioration of the pan and connections caused by being exposed to the elements.

I don't think theft of service is as much of a problem as it once was. "Smart meters" can report usage hourly and the data can be analyzed to learn the normal patterns of usage and report any radical change which would trigger a visit.

-Hal
 
mbrooke said:
Why don't POCOs just put the meter on the pole or in their equipment somewhere? Having un-metered power and who owns what is a recipe for problems and power theft.
Click to expand...

Another big issue... your can and or breaker panel is mounted to the POCO pole. Car hits the pole and breaks the pole... you gonna get an electrician to move alol the equipment so the pole can be changed out?
or when it’s left on the ground how mad you gonna be when it’s 15 degrees outside?

leave it on the house, it only makes sense.
 
hbiss said:
Locating the meter at or close to the customer is really the only practical way to access the customer's service. I suppose you could locate the meter on the pole or pedestal where the service originates (and actually that is sometimes done) but that can get unwieldy fast if there is more than one customer/meter per pole or pedestal.

With the advent of remote meter reading I would like to see meters allowed to be located inside the customer's premises again. That would eliminate the deterioration of the pan and connections caused by being exposed to the elements.

I don't think theft of service is as much of a problem as it once was. "Smart meters" can report usage hourly and the data can be analyzed to learn the normal patterns of usage and report any radical change which would trigger a visit.

-Hal
Click to expand...

Utilities are still required to read the meters or inspect them yearly.
they don’t need to be inside.
 
Hv&Lv said:
And some meters are on the pole. CT metering is done at the pole many times.
its far too expensive and inaccurate for smaller loads like residential to CT meter every house.
Click to expand...

Aren't smart meters basically CTs attached to a circuit board?
 
Hv&Lv said:
Another big issue... your can and or breaker panel is mounted to the POCO pole. Car hits the pole and breaks the pole... you gonna get an electrician to move alol the equipment so the pole can be changed out?
or when it’s left on the ground how mad you gonna be when it’s 15 degrees outside?

leave it on the house, it only makes sense.
Click to expand...

Just run the service drop tap through some CTs and a little encapsulated computer. Or a self contained box on the pole with the service wires going in/out kind of like a RONK.

Something like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dypG_P1jzPk
 
Some of the POCOs in this area are moving the meters to poles at property lines. The customer is now responsible entirely from the load of the meter to the residence, farm or whatever. POCO techs no longer need to get in the customers yards for anything. No liability for downed secondary or faulted underground. Someone from a hundred miles away disconnects or restores power for payment disputes.
 
ptonsparky said:
Some of the POCOs in this area are moving the meters to poles at property lines. The customer is now responsible entirely from the load of the meter to the residence, farm or whatever. POCO techs no longer need to get in the customers yards for anything. No liability for downed secondary or faulted underground. Someone from a hundred miles away disconnects or restores power for payment disputes.
Click to expand...

Same here.
 
ptonsparky said:
Some of the POCOs in this area are moving the meters to poles at property lines. The customer is now responsible entirely from the load of the meter to the residence, farm or whatever. POCO techs no longer need to get in the customers yards for anything. No liability for downed secondary or faulted underground. Someone from a hundred miles away disconnects or restores power for payment disputes.
Click to expand...

I like this :)
 
mbrooke said:
Why don't POCOs just put the meter on the pole or in their equipment somewhere? Having un-metered power and who owns what is a recipe for problems and power theft.
Click to expand...

Seems a little unpractical for some applications like multi-tenant situations, especially larger ones.
 
Where I live, all utility wiring is underground so no poles to mount on.
Putting the meter on the house costs less than a pedestal.
 
mbrooke said:
Why don't POCOs just put the meter on the pole or in their equipment somewhere? Having un-metered power and who owns what is a recipe for problems and power theft.
Click to expand...

I think the real reason for meters to be on private property is because that's the way it was done in the beginning and it would be expensive to change for no real gain.

Change always sounds good unless you are the one paying for it.
 
mbrooke said:
Why don't POCOs just put the meter on the pole or in their equipment somewhere? Having un-metered power and who owns what is a recipe for problems and power theft.
Click to expand...

Why would having it on the premises result in unmetered power?
We, and many others here, have ours monitored remotely for both gas and electrical energy.
 
It makes sense to me to put the metering near the street, as that would be easier for the POCO to manage. If a car hits it, the POCO replaces the meter and the meter base... But, you'd need larger conductors from the meter to the structure. My house power feed is overhead for about 75 feet to an intermediate pole where it transitions underground for about another 100 feet to the meter base at the house. I wanted to move the meter to the intermediate pole so I could feed the house and an outbuilding from there. But the wire the POCO buried between the house and pole is way too small to meet the NEC Service Lateral requirements (NEC would require 4/0 Al and the POCO wire appears to be #2 or perhaps 1/0 Al). That wire is under a driveway and some concrete and is direct buried. I'm not going to dig it up and replace so it will stay as a POCO sized set of conductors which means the meter stays on the house.

This could work for new installs, but any buried service POCO conductors are likely going to be undersized since NESC and NEC are not on the same page for sizing. Or, someone needs to redefine where the service delivery point is to keep it under NESC control for existing installs.
 
suemarkp said:
It makes sense to me to put the metering near the street, as that would be easier for the POCO to manage. If a car hits it, the POCO replaces the meter and the meter base... But, you'd need larger conductors from the meter to the structure. My house power feed is overhead for about 75 feet to an intermediate pole where it transitions underground for about another 100 feet to the meter base at the house. I wanted to move the meter to the intermediate pole so I could feed the house and an outbuilding from there. But the wire the POCO buried between the house and pole is way too small to meet the NEC Service Lateral requirements (NEC would require 4/0 Al and the POCO wire appears to be #2 or perhaps 1/0 Al). That wire is under a driveway and some concrete and is direct buried. I'm not going to dig it up and replace so it will stay as a POCO sized set of conductors which means the meter stays on the house.

This could work for new installs, but any buried service POCO conductors are likely going to be undersized since NESC and NEC are not on the same page for sizing. Or, someone needs to redefine where the service delivery point is to keep it under NESC control for existing installs.
Click to expand...

Who says larger conductors? And a base? You can't tell me that someone can't make a low cost box or device that around the wires on the pole headed toward the service drop.
 
Sure they could. But what would the typical service delivery point be and where would it be (I'm thinking residential here) if their meter base goes away or whatever the metering is is moved to the street? I'm sure the POCO's wouldn't mind saying the service delivery point is a box at the street and the cable from there to your building is on you to provide. The meter base does provide some conveniences -- in most areas it defines the service delivery point which is the boundary for wire size jurisdiction, and it is a convenient utility disconnect for an electrician to use without having to get the utility involved (just pull the meter, but let utility know so they can reseal the box when you're done).
 
Since deregulation, some places you own everything from the transformer all the way to the building. Have seen metering on the primary side at the street in Arkansas just for a Wal-mart.
 
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