Relocating 3 wire dryer receptacle legal?

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Mustwin351

Senior Member
Location
Texas
I would like to relocate an existing residential 3 wire dryer receptacle to another wall but I'm guessing this is not acceptable by code. I prefer not to run a new 4 wire circuit all the way back from the outside service panel (which of course is the best choice but a lot of work.) Any thoughts comments on this?
 

norcal

Senior Member
I would like to relocate an existing residential 3 wire dryer receptacle to another wall but I'm guessing this is not acceptable by code. I prefer not to run a new 4 wire circuit all the way back from the outside service panel (which of course is the best choice but a lot of work.) Any thoughts comments on this?

The 3-wire receptacles are only legal in existing installations, you move it it is no longer existing, just my opinion.
 

GerryB

Senior Member
I would like to relocate an existing residential 3 wire dryer receptacle to another wall but I'm guessing this is not acceptable by code. I prefer not to run a new 4 wire circuit all the way back from the outside service panel (which of course is the best choice but a lot of work.) Any thoughts comments on this?
I can let you know Tuesday. I am having an inspection of a bath remodel where I had to move the washer and dryer receptacles to the basement. Went with 3 wire (actually didn't even think of it till this post) because his dryer has a 3-prong cord. Had to put a j-box and switch from bx to nm. Ground tail in the j-box and there is a spot for the ground on the base of the surface receptacle I used. We'll see:)
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
I can let you know Tuesday. I am having an inspection of a bath remodel where I had to move the washer and dryer receptacles to the basement. Went with 3 wire (actually didn't even think of it till this post) because his dryer has a 3-prong cord. Had to put a j-box and switch from bx to nm. Ground tail in the j-box and there is a spot for the ground on the base of the surface receptacle I used. We'll see:)

There is no way that should pass.

Not saying it won't, only that it should not.
 

GoldDigger

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Placerville, CA, USA
Occupation
Retired PV System Designer
Why? Are 3 wire dryer cords illegal. As I said they receptacle is perfectly grounded.
Three wire cords are only permitted for existing receptacles configured for three wire receptacles. Unless the load does not use the neutral, in which case 3 wire with two hots and an EGC is OJ.
But that will be a different receptacle type from one with two hots and a neutral with no ground.
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
Why? Are 3 wire dryer cords illegal. As I said they receptacle is perfectly grounded.

The cord is not the problem.

The issue is that the only reason we are allowed to use the neutral as the grounding means for ranges and dryers is by an exception.

That exception only applies to existing circuits, it does not apply to existing dryers.

You relocated the circuit so it is no longer existing,it is new.

You would have to install a four wire outlet and replace the cord on the dryer.
 

Dennis Alwon

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Chapel Hill, NC
Occupation
Retired Electrical Contractor
I think the question is that there are millions of ranges and dryers out there that are 3 wire so what would be the issue? My question is why was it ever compliant...:D
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
I think the question is that there are millions of ranges and dryers out there that are 3 wire so what would be the issue? My question is why was it ever compliant...:D

The issue is the code.

Why did Ryan and Mike H get rid of the allowance to use the grounded conductor for ground separate buildings and structures when that is how every service in American is supplied?
 

Dennis Alwon

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Chapel Hill, NC
Occupation
Retired Electrical Contractor
The issue is the code.


Yes I know and that's why I wondered why the 3 wire was allowed.. I don't understand your response to my post.


Why did Ryan and Mike H get rid of the allowance to use the grounded conductor for ground separate buildings and structures when that is how every service in American is supplied?

The feeder to a separate structure is not a service as you know so again why was a 3 wire run allowed for all those years--- I know when I was a kid in NYC we had to run 4 wires to an electric range or dryer but then again it was a rare sight to see electric appliances.
 

dkidd

Senior Member
Location
here
Occupation
PE
From Wiki (Tesla forgive me)

Fixed appliances on three-wire circuits[edit]

In North America, the cases of some kitchen stoves (ranges, ovens), cook tops, clothes dryers and other specifically listed appliances were grounded through their neutral wires as a measure to conserve copper from copper cables during World War II. This practice was removed from the NEC in the 1996 edition, but existing installations (called "old work") may still allow the cases of such listed appliances to be connected to the neutral conductor for grounding.

This practice arose from the three-wire system used to supply both 120 volt and 240 volt loads. Because these listed appliances often have components that use either 120, or both 120 and 240 volts, there is often some current on the neutral wire. This differs from the protective grounding wire, which only carries current under fault conditions. Using the neutral conductor for grounding the equipment enclosure was considered safe since the devices were permanently wired to the supply and so the neutral was unlikely to be broken without also breaking both supply conductors. Also, the unbalanced current due to lamps and small motors in the appliances was small compared to the rating of the conductors and therefore unlikely to cause a large voltage drop in the neutral conductor.
 

K8MHZ

Senior Member
Location
Michigan. It's a beautiful peninsula, I've looked
Occupation
Electrician
Yes I know and that's why I wondered why the 3 wire was allowed.. I don't understand your response to my post.

I could be wrong, but my understanding was that when the code required a 4th wire, there were no manufacturers of 4 wire NM so the NEC allowed three wire so long as the neutral completely surrounded the hot conductors, i.e. SEC cable.
 

GerryB

Senior Member
I can let you know Tuesday. I am having an inspection of a bath remodel where I had to move the washer and dryer receptacles to the basement. Went with 3 wire (actually didn't even think of it till this post) because his dryer has a 3-prong cord. Had to put a j-box and switch from bx to nm. Ground tail in the j-box and there is a spot for the ground on the base of the surface receptacle I used. We'll see:)
Did have an inspection and no problem, although they sent a building official (ex plumber) to check all trades and not the actual EI. I'm sure the other guys are correct, probably should be 4-wire and change the cord. I did ask another inspector in a different town, a real old timer, he said he would let it go.
 
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