Fire Alarm guys! Help needed!

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Hey guys,

I am installing a Simplex class B fire alarm system with some addressable modules. My supervisor mentioned to me something about an "addressing tool" and said that none of the devices could be terminated because they would "address themselves". When I asked him what that meant he was very vague and I dont think knows, himself haha.

Am I wrong thinking that class B devices are non addressable? None have a dipswitch.. Or is this something on the FACP end that I am misunderstanding. Cheers!
 

PaulMmn

Senior Member
Location
Union, KY, USA
Occupation
EIT - Engineer in Training, Lafayette College
If the modules are wired with Ethernet, they could be addressed from a central address server (DHCP):
"a DHCP server dynamically assigns an IP address and other network configuration parameters to each device on a network" -- Wikipedia

Once the address is assigned, you can communicate with it. Some DHCP servers let you reserve an address for a device. Of course, you need to find out which address is assigned to which device, or you'll never know where it is!

To simplify (or complicate-- your choice): each device has a hard-wired address (its MAC address), which is unique. Given a set of IP Addresses, you can assign an address to a MAC address. If you keep track of which MAC address goes with which IP address, and where you put that device, you can map the building.
 

Gary11734

Senior Member
Location
Florida
Hey guys,

I am installing a Simplex class B fire alarm system with some addressable modules. My supervisor mentioned to me something about an "addressing tool" and said that none of the devices could be terminated because they would "address themselves". When I asked him what that meant he was very vague and I dont think knows, himself haha.

Am I wrong thinking that class B devices are non addressable? None have a dipswitch.. Or is this something on the FACP end that I am misunderstanding. Cheers!

If it’s the old class b with an EOR at the end of zone, then no , they are not addressable .

what is the model number of the simplex your installing?
 

Jon456

Senior Member
Location
Colorado
For ethernet devices:

If you want to map the circuits, then you do not want to use dynamic IP addressing, because the DHCP server (built into the router) could issue different IP addresses to the connected devices after a reboot. You will need to go into the advanced settings of the router and assign static IP addresses to each MAC addresses of each device. Sometimes this is called "Address Reservation." The router will then reserve that assigned IP address for that particular device, even after the router is rebooted.

Be sure to save your router configuration to an external file (like on a flash drive) so that you don't lose your settings if you need to do a firmware update.
 

PaulMmn

Senior Member
Location
Union, KY, USA
Occupation
EIT - Engineer in Training, Lafayette College
Thank you for the replies!

Is it just me, or is this far beyond the standard installation of a construction electrician? Woukd this not be the kob of a fire alarm technician? Tyco, etc?

If you're comfortable with a computer, and connected your computer to The Internet with just the instruction book, addressing devices is only a bit more complicated. Have you changed the default password on your Cable Router? The Cable Router probably lets you assign IP address reservations...

Next step-- read the fine manuals that come with the fire alarm stations! You may be the next expert!! The 'addressing tool' my just be a software program for your laptop. But that implies a working network that your laptop could talk to.

Uh, isn't there someone already contracted to set up the alarm stations?
 
Yes, there is a fire tech company in place. They just have not been on site and I was very confused. I thought maybe I had missed something. For my own info, is there any reason I cannot terminate the devices (pull stations, heat/smokes, loud speakers, etc?) Before the FACP end has been tied in or any of the modules? It is absolutely a class B system with a field EOL.

Perhaps my supervisor was mistakenly thinking it was a class A system? I still don't know of any such "addressing tool"
 

Gary11734

Senior Member
Location
Florida
Hey guys,

I am installing a Simplex class B fire alarm system with some addressable modules. My supervisor mentioned to me something about an "addressing tool" and said that none of the devices could be terminated because they would "address themselves". When I asked him what that meant he was very vague and I dont think knows, himself haha.

Am I wrong thinking that class B devices are non addressable? None have a dipswitch.. Or is this something on the FACP end that I am misunderstanding. Cheers!

The Class, A or B, is how the loop is installed. Class B, the circuit with EOL resistor that doesn't come back to the panel. Class A, the loop returns to the panel and the resistor is there. Class A has better fail safe characteristics... If the line gets cut in one direction, the panel can still see the Class A loop that is attached back at the panel since it's terminated twice. You are mixing up class A, B with addressable panels... I can't remember if they still use EOL in addressable panels. Anybody know? Since you have the addresses at each device, the panel can see if any these addresses drop out as it pulses the loop. No need for a Resistor. And, you can T-Tap... They still may use the resistor. I can't remember...

I remember Simplex first addressable panel. It was installed at Turnberry Isle Condo in North Miami Beach. The very first one. It was a 2100.... The later ones of many were the Simplex 2120 that were around for years. This was Circa 1980... I like the old ones better. Non- Addressable. You didn't need the vendor with his computer to make the panel work.... The Fire companies made out like bandits after controlling the front end of the FA panels....

Gone are the days using Fenwall products in any fire alarm... It was a good time...
 

AK_FACP

Member
Location
CT
The Class, A or B, is how the loop is installed. Class B, the circuit with EOL resistor that doesn't come back to the panel. Class A, the loop returns to the panel and the resistor is there. Class A has better fail safe characteristics... If the line gets cut in one direction, the panel can still see the Class A loop that is attached back at the panel since it's terminated twice. You are mixing up class A, B with addressable panels... I can't remember if they still use EOL in addressable panels. Anybody know? Since you have the addresses at each device, the panel can see if any these addresses drop out as it pulses the loop. No need for a Resistor. And, you can T-Tap... They still may use the resistor. I can't remember...

I remember Simplex first addressable panel. It was installed at Turnberry Isle Condo in North Miami Beach. The very first one. It was a 2100.... The later ones of many were the Simplex 2120 that were around for years. This was Circa 1980... I like the old ones better. Non- Addressable. You didn't need the vendor with his computer to make the panel work.... The Fire companies made out like bandits after controlling the front end of the FA panels....

Gone are the days using Fenwall products in any fire alarm... It was a good time...

...no EOL resistor on an addressable systems SLC, we still use the EOL on the NAC circuits on an addressable system if they are done Class B. Like you said the SLC allows for devices to be T-tapped into the system unlike the old conventional systems. On most addressable panels I’ve done the SLC is also able to be wired Class A if desired for extra survivability.
 
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