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Thread: SPD to protect GFCIs

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by don_resqcapt19 View Post
    From the first draft report for the 2020 code.

    From the substantiation for the PI that resulted in 230.67.

    Notice the word, "insurance companies" in this argument, (small print). They are driving this and the manufactures are lapping it up. But, the manufacturers are going to have a real hard time with Green and Fazio lawyers when this thing fails and the house burns down.

    Morgan and Morgan, "For the People" ring loud in this one.

  2. #22
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    Insurance companies aren't smart enough to think this up on their own. If there weren't manufacturers pushing their products insurance companies wouldn't have a clue. Who is a big manufacturer of surge protection devices? Leviton, who is also a big producer of AFCI devices, so they know the ropes.

    -Hal

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by hbiss View Post
    Insurance companies aren't smart enough to think this up on their own. If there weren't manufacturers pushing their products insurance companies wouldn't have a clue. Who is a big manufacturer of surge protection devices? Leviton, who is also a big producer of AFCI devices, so they know the ropes.

    -Hal
    This sounds like what came first, the chicken or the egg.

  4. #24
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    The manufacturers. When the insurance companies found out that they can limit their liability when there is a fire and the smokes didn't go off and the building didn't have surge protection they jumped on it.

    -Hal

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by hbiss View Post
    The manufacturers. When the insurance companies found out that they can limit their liability when there is a fire and the smokes didn't go off and the building didn't have surge protection they jumped on it.

    -Hal

    Surge is a big rip off. It will take code enforcement to get the public to buy.

    Oh well, just more for the contractor to mark up for profit.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by hbiss View Post
    Here we go again! Design the damn devices properly so they are resistant to damage from surges or indicate when they are damaged, don't create another "golden egg" for manufacturers.

    -Hal
    The UL product standard was already changed to increase the amount of surge protection within the GFCI itself, but there is limited space in the device. Not sure anything more can be done with the device itself.
    Don, Illinois
    (All code citations are 2017 unless otherwise noted)

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary11734 View Post
    ...Oh well, just more for the contractor to mark up for profit.
    It's more like: just more that drives up the price and convinces the client not to bother with the project.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    It's more like: just more that drives up the price and convinces the client not to bother with the project.
    Agree...

  9. #29
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    When a MOV (metal oxide varistor) is near end of life (from many small surge strikes over span of time), it would conduct at lower and lower voltage until it can even conduct with regular voltage say 120v (from the MCOV of 150v), then it would go into thermal runaway (burn) because of the continuous conduction. Can anyone give example of any 120v GFCI receptacle with burnt MOV. Doesn't it burn the entire receptacle since the housing is plastic?

  10. #30
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    I once had someone from the School Board come up to me as we were finishing a new School. The Fire panel was at the main entrance. They asked me, what if a bus blasted through the front doors and destroyed the Fire alarm panel. Would the kids be safe and should we have a back up to the main fire alarm panel? (I wish I had a picture of a dog cocking head right now)


    Ok, this thread of MOV's in GFI's and new code rules reminds me of that BC headache.


    A couple of things to remember;

    1) If you're a plumber, don't chew your fingernails.

    2) A Chicken eats with his pecker

    3) DO NOT COIL those wires coming from the SPD before you make them up at the breaker...

    The class is now in recess!

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