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Thread: Do installed receptacles need to always be hot ?

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary11734 View Post
    It would seem the inspector could fail the inspection because he couldn't test polarity or see if the GFI functions correctly.
    Yes he could. All that would be needed is to turn on the switch.

    Charles E. Beck, P.E., Seattle
    Comments based on 2017 NEC unless otherwise noted.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by augie47 View Post
    i think 210.52(2) might be interpreted to say that.
    I think you could switch both receptacles on a duplex outlet but this provision would require you to have another receptacle to cover the required receptacles in a room if you did that.
    Bob

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by petersonra View Post
    I think you could switch both receptacles on a duplex outlet but this provision would require you to have another receptacle to cover the required receptacles in a room if you did that.
    I think not, Bob. As a couple of earlier posts have said, if you have a wall-switched overhead light, then the notion of "wall-switched lighting outlet" is not relevant. The Exception is telling us that you can do the one in lieu of the other. It does not say that anytime you wall-switch a receptacle, that receptacle becomes defined as a "lighting outlet."

    Charles E. Beck, P.E., Seattle
    Comments based on 2017 NEC unless otherwise noted.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by petersonra View Post
    I think you could switch both receptacles on a duplex outlet but this provision would require you to have another receptacle to cover the required receptacles in a room if you did that.
    Why? Are both used for lighting? If it is used for the required lighting for the room then it does not fall under the required receptacle in the room for outlets anyway. Nothing says we cannot design the outlets to be switched off at a location, only that the be spaced apart, and be separate from the lighting circuits that are switched.
    Now, would it make sense to switch them both separately? That is a different question but falls under design.
    Student of electrical codes. Please Take others advice first.

  5. #55
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    Wait till the code catches up with Alexa, 10x, smart home, etc..

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by charlie b View Post
    I came into this one late, and the discussion is spinning my head around (need more coffee!). Here is my view:

    1. Let’s say that the room under discussion has an overhead light that is controlled by a wall switch.
    2. Exception 1 to 210.70(A)(1) is therefore not relevant.
    3. As a result, paragraph 210.52(2) is also not relevant.
    4. If I were to install a wall switch that turns on and off one or more (or for that matter all) of the wall-mounted receptacles in the room, those receptacles would not be “controlled by a wall switch in accordance with 210.70(A)(1), Exception 1.”
    5. I conclude that those receptacle can be counted as the receptacles required under 210.52.


    Bottom line: no code violation.
    perfectly said, and I don't see any flaw in the logic. I would add that if I had a single receptacle designated for required lighting in the room and then I had a switch that turned off all the receptacles then it would still be in line with what you wrote above. In fact the required lighting outlet switch could be overridden by the receptacle switch and be turned off too. In fact, it would probably satisfy the Title 24 ASHRAE 90 crowd, and if they are reading this it might become the next additional cost in new construction.


    I know what I don't know, and I know where to go to find it!

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