Landing stranded wire on screw terminals

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ActionDave

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https://images.tradeservice.com/9ETBOIYK8205G6UU/ATTACHMENTS/DIR100097/PASSEME07915_B40_Q61.pdf

Here is a link to legrand's company website / wiring instructions for a very common receptacle. Please note where it indicates solid wire for both back and side terminals.
That is just literature about the product, not installation instructions. At the bottom of page one in the chart it says the recept is UL listed. That means it has to accept stranded wire. Don's post #63 shows the language from UL. It is very clear.
 

iwire

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Really the manufacturer calls out solid wire but it's not correct..... interesting.

Dave, you have been shown at least twice that the UL listing REQUIRES that receptacle devices accept stranded wire.

Can you comment on why you have ignored that information?

Are you also aware using 'stakons' or other fork terminals on devices not listed for fork terminals is a listing violation?
 

mivey

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Can you comment on why you have ignored that information?
It is no easy thing for someone in a group of a dozen peers to break from the herd. They just can't believe they have been so wrong for so long. It is a tough thing. I don't like it either but it happens sometimes.
 

ActionDave

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It is no easy thing for someone in a group of a dozen peers to break from the herd. They just can't believe they have been so wrong for so long. It is a tough thing. I don't like it either but it happens sometimes.
What's even more ironic is that he said they require using crimp on connectors. Unless those connectors are approved by the manufacturer it is a violation of the listing.

Turning down legal install and forcing illegal is a double whammy hard pill to swallow. Takes a real strong man to own up to that.
 

infinity

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http://www.leviton.com/OA_HTML/ibcG...5NSpIzAA&label=IBE&appName=IBE&minisite=10251

Here is leviton's wiring instructions for a T5325-E Decora duplex rec., nothing fancy. note 3

As Golddigger states those instructions are consistent with the listing requirement of the device to accept solid or stranded conductors on the side terminals and only solid conductors on the back stab. From your pdf:

3. Terminal screws accept up to #12 AWG copper or copper clad wire.
To Quickwire TM : Insert straight #14 AWG solid copper or copper clad wires
into round Quickwire™ holes. Quickwire™ terminals accept #14 AWG
solid copper or copper clad wires ONLY!
 
landing stranded wire on rec.

landing stranded wire on rec.

The products written instructions / diagrams / specs govern. If you do not follow them you void the product listing / labeling as per N.E.C. There are receptacle manufacturers that allow for stranded wire or sta-kon terminal rated in their written instructions, but not all.
 

infinity

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The products written instructions / diagrams / specs govern. If you do not follow them you void the product listing / labeling as per N.E.C. There are receptacle manufacturers that allow for stranded wire or sta-kon terminal rated in their written instructions, but not all.


Can you provide a list of the manufacturers who do not permit the stranded conductor connection even though it's part of the listing requirement of the device? Just for the record I have never terminated a stranded conductor on a simple receptacle binding screw but I have repaired quite a few.
 

don_resqcapt19

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The products written instructions / diagrams / specs govern. If you do not follow them you void the product listing / labeling as per N.E.C. There are receptacle manufacturers that allow for stranded wire or sta-kon terminal rated in their written instructions, but not all.
It its my opinion that a receptacle where the instructions do not permit the use of stranded wire on the screw terminals is in violation of the listing requirements.
 

mivey

Senior Member
What's even more ironic is that he said they require using crimp on connectors. Unless those connectors are approved by the manufacturer it is a violation of the listing.

Turning down legal install and forcing illegal is a double whammy hard pill to swallow. Takes a real strong man to own up to that.
Yes, that makes it much worse.

Attention troups! Defensive positions! :D
 

GoldDigger

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It its my opinion that a receptacle where the instructions do not permit the use of stranded wire on the screw terminals is in violation of the listing requirements.
The first instructions posted, that do not allow stranded, were for a combination receptacle and wireless remote control. That might remove it from the listing scope for general purpose receptacles.
 

ActionDave

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The products written instructions / diagrams / specs govern. If you do not follow them you void the product listing / labeling as per N.E.C. There are receptacle manufacturers that allow for stranded wire or sta-kon terminal rated in their written instructions, but not all.
The first set of instructions you linked to allow for stranded wire and the second set are not instructions, just advertising.
 

Smart $

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The first instructions posted, that do not allow stranded, were for a combination receptacle and wireless remote control. That might remove it from the listing scope for general purpose receptacles.

The first set of instructions you linked to allow for stranded wire and the second set are not instructions, just advertising.
The very first link referred to this product in general:
http://www.leviton.com/OA_HTML/ProductDetail.jsp?partnumber=VRR15-1LZ&section=44148&minisite=10251

Data sheet for listing and installation instructions (which limit binding screws to solid only) links can be found on that page.

As GD points out, it is sold as a switch-receptacle kit, and each component is listed separately. The receptacle is listed under Category RTRT Receptacles for Plugs and Attachment Plugs, File E13399 (http://database.ul.com/cgi-bin/XYV/...n=versionless&parent_id=1073992975&sequence=1) but you cannot verify listing because it appears to be listed under an individual receptacle model number and not as the kit model number.
 
I have seen tinning cause problems. The connection gets hot and the solder reaches a plastic state and relieves the tension from the screw, causing a bad connection. And bad connection means more heat, more heat means more solder being deformed and so on.

I also have soldered for a bit over half a century.

When I started the electrician I worked for soldered all connections and then placed diapers on them, teaching me to do the same. For you younger persons who don't know what that is, a "diaper" is made of flexible rubber, has what looks like a small pot with handle.......... "handle" extends out forming a ring. The "pot" part is placed over the twisted and soldered wire ends, the handle part goes up over and between the connected wires and the ring part is stretched out over the diaper (pot).

I moved from the area where I did the wiring in the homes built in 1962 using that technique.

About ten years ago I came across an old house which was wire connected in the same manner in southern California. I was replacing fixtures and in most of those the solder had disintegrated which allowed resistance, wires had heated causing the insulation to either fall off or become so brittle they had to be repaired.

At any rate, I noticed the deterioration of the solder joints in the ones in calif and wondered if the same happened those I did.

Until I saw that, I still believed soldered joints were better, but now my belief is in twisted connections, good wire nuts, and if in damp areas using an electrical dielectric grease in them.
 

Jim1959

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Location
Longmont, CO
Receptacle with lug connections

Receptacle with lug connections

Try using a better grade receptacle with lug connections designed for stranded or solid wire like a Hubbel 5362 series. They are much better quality, will last longer and save you installation time.
 
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