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Thread: FA Circuits

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    FA Circuits

    Class B fire alarm system. These two devices on same loop/circuit and it’s a full conduit job. No need for two pipe out of device. You can have the in and out cabling in the same pipe, correct? One pipe would be fine as I drew in as long as you have junction point correct? Also , can you have IDC and NAC circuits in same pipe? Thanks.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mstrlucky74 View Post
    Class B fire alarm system. These two devices on same loop/circuit and it’s a full conduit job. No need for two pipe out of device. You can have the in and out cabling in the same pipe, correct? One pipe would be fine as I drew in as long as you have junction point correct? Also , can you have IDC and NAC circuits in same pipe? Thanks.
    For Class B you can run the feed and return for a device in the same pipe.

    For IDC and NAC, as a general rule you can run them in the same pipe as well. Check with the fire alarm panel vendor to be sure. I will say, as a matter of practice, it's not a good idea, unless you have a very long run where absolutely nothing will now, or in the future, branch off. It only takes a couple of times having to pull all the wire out of a pipe back through a couple junction boxes or so to see the wisdom of separate pipes for IDC's and NAC's. You can't ever just pull half the cables out. It was a lesson I don't need to be taught twice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gadfly56 View Post
    For Class B you can run the feed and return for a device in the same pipe.

    For IDC and NAC, as a general rule you can run them in the same pipe as well. Check with the fire alarm panel vendor to be sure. I will say, as a matter of practice, it's not a good idea, unless you have a very long run where absolutely nothing will now, or in the future, branch off. It only takes a couple of times having to pull all the wire out of a pipe back through a couple junction boxes or so to see the wisdom of separate pipes for IDC's and NAC's. You can't ever just pull half the cables out. It was a lesson I don't need to be taught twice.

    Thanks.

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    One other thing. The modules( that are on same circuit as smokes) get M and Z type...one cable for power . It only shows the Z(power) from the module to the waterflow so I'm not sure id that Z cable goes all the way back. I was going to ask if it could be in the same pipe as the M(data loop).
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    Quote Originally Posted by gadfly56 View Post
    For Class B you can run the feed and return for a device in the same pipe.

    For IDC and NAC, as a general rule you can run them in the same pipe as well. Check with the fire alarm panel vendor to be sure. I will say, as a matter of practice, it's not a good idea, unless you have a very long run where absolutely nothing will now, or in the future, branch off. It only takes a couple of times having to pull all the wire out of a pipe back through a couple junction boxes or so to see the wisdom of separate pipes for IDC's and NAC's. You can't ever just pull half the cables out. It was a lesson I don't need to be taught twice.

    BTW, class B there is no return.....just in and out as I assume that's what you meant.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mstrlucky74 View Post
    One other thing. The modules( that are on same circuit as smokes) get M and Z type...one cable for power . It only shows the Z(power) from the module to the waterflow so I'm not sure id that Z cable goes all the way back. I was going to ask if it could be in the same pipe as the M(data loop).
    They type Z cable should terminate at the AIM device. It would not go all the way back to the panel.

    On your original post. Single devices can have both send and return in the same conduit even on a class A circuit.
    Last edited by luckylerado; 03-15-19 at 12:39 PM.

    1N73LL1G3NC3 15 7H3 4BILI7Y 70 4D4P7 70 CH4NG3.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mstrlucky74 View Post
    BTW, class B there is no return.....just in and out as I assume that's what you meant.
    At the junction box, you have to go either right or left. If you go left, you need a pair in and a pair out so you can go back across the junction box and catch the strobe (or whatever it is) on the other side. If that second strobe is not the end-of-line, you'll need yet another pair to go back into the junction box and then back up the feeder pipe to its next destination.

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    Quote Originally Posted by luckylerado View Post
    They type Z cable should terminate at the AIM device. It would not go all the way back to the panel.

    On your original post. Single devices can have both send and return in the same conduit even on a class A circuit.
    True, but there are restrictions. I didn't want to confuse the issue.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gadfly56 View Post
    True, but there are restrictions.
    There are. It is important to know the exceptions to the separation rules for sure. I see, and have been guilty of, a lot of wasted time and material before studying up on this.

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    I normally bid and pipe the jobs as class A, for the main pipe run, only in/out for the short distances; helps in pulling the wire and trouble shooting start up.

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