2" concrete Service Conductors Outside the Building

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Lady Engineer

Lady Engineer

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New Jersey
I have the age old question. I have a service in which the contractor does not want to install the service entrance conductors in concrete. He says it doesn't say in the code that it needs to be in at least be in 2" concrete per the NEC. However, I know there's somewhere it justifies that the service conductors can not be more than a certain length before terminating into a main or a switchboard/panel with 6 mains or less.

My question is...what's the length, and where in the Code can this be found? Believe it's 10 feet or less, but I'm not sure. Please help!! :(
 
There is no NEC defined definition as to length that the conductors can enter the building. This is an answer the AHJ or inspector would have to provide unless there is a local code defining the length.
 
The code does not give a length because it does not permit any service conductors inside the building. The word nearest means exactly that...I know that most do not agree with this, but that is my reading of the code section.
 
don_resqcapt19 said:
The code does not give a length because it does not permit any service conductors inside the building. The word nearest means exactly that...I know that most do not agree with this, but that is my reading of the code section.
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Yes, I agree, but my boss and I are trying to give the location in the code that states this. The contractor is challenging why he must encase the service entrance conductors in concrete. See the problem is they mounted the service not in the service room as instructed, so he's trying say well the code doesn't specifically say they you can not run service entrance conductors inside a building. It just says if not under 2" of concrete, etc., they are inside the building. Having the article no. will help fight this change order..

Thanks so much gentlemen!! :)
 
230.70(A)(1) requires the service disconnecting means to be installed in a readily accessible location either outside of a building or structure or inside nearest the point of entrance of the service conductors.

Chris
 
Lady Engineer said:
Yes, I agree, but my boss and I are trying to give the location in the code that states this. The contractor is challenging why he must encase the service entrance conductors in concrete. See the problem is they mounted the service not in the service room as instructed, so he's trying say well the code doesn't specifically say they you can not run service entrance conductors inside a building. It just says if not under 2" of concrete, etc., they are inside the building. Having the article no. will help fight this change order..

Thanks so much gentlemen!! :)
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I think Don's reading of the section is on the money.

That said I think we must acknowledge that in many areas they allow from a few to several feet of service conductors inside the building.
 
iwire said:
I think Don's reading of the section is on the money.

That said I think we must acknowledge that in many areas they allow from a few to several feet of service conductors inside the building.
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Agreed, and if you take what Chris posted

230.70(A)(1) requires the service disconnecting means to be installed in a readily accessible location either outside of a building or structure or inside nearest the point of entrance of the service conductors.

Chris
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And then called the AHJ they will tell you what they allow.
The inspectors I deal with in NC use a rule of thumb for length they allow. If I do a back to back install they allow twice the length of the panel, for the service wire.
A inspector jokingly told me once,and he was correct, you can wrap the service wire around the outside of the building 50 times but once you go inside it better not be more than 80 inches.
 
Length of service conductors inside building is a local issue, no distance, 2, 3, 5 and 15 ft are all answers I have heard. Washington is pretty generous with 15ft of service raceway
 
As noted, the allowed distance varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction and on occasion from job to job. A residence with service cable hidden in a wall
might be looked at differently than an industrial plant with supervised maintenance and SE in rigid conduit. Don't put yourself in a position to have to eat crow if you happen upon a lenient inspector. Let the AHJ make the call.
 
You can enter a building and go any length to a FIRE PUMP and the conduit MUST be incased in 2" of concrete. Maybe this is what is confusing you?
 
I'd let him install them, then when he gets red flagged and has to correct his install it's his dollar. No way as the engineer would I approve that install.
 
Hmmm..Ok. I forgot about the Fire Pump, and they have a tendency to have a separate service and are usually encased in concrete. With the market the way it is, these guys will do anything to make a buck.

Ok..Thanks.
 
Lady Engineer said:
Yes, I agree, but my boss and I are trying to give the location in the code that states this. The contractor is challenging why he must encase the service entrance conductors in concrete. See the problem is they mounted the service not in the service room as instructed, so he's trying say well the code doesn't specifically say they you can not run service entrance conductors inside a building. It just says if not under 2" of concrete, etc., they are inside the building. Having the article no. will help fight this change order..

Thanks so much gentlemen!! :)
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According to 230.6 your service conductors are to be considered outside as long as they are in a raceway and encased in at least 2" of concrete or under 18" of earth. So you may run your service to any point of a building as long as you follow any of 230.6, and terminated at the nearest point of entrance 230.70(A)1.

230.70(A)1 is up to the AHJ for a specific footage after you emerge for the earth.
 
You are allowed to run service conductor inside a building as long as you follow 230.6 and 230.70(A)1

1) If your conductors are in a raceway below 18" of earth
2) Installed under not less than 2" of concrete or in 2" of brick
3) Terminated at the nearest point of entrance (according to the AHJ)
 
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