250.8 addition

[bphgravity]

1. Section 250.8

2. Add new text (in bold)

3. 250.8 Connection of Grounding and Bonding Equipment.
Grounding conductors and bonding jumpers shall...
...Sheet metal screws shall not be used to connect grounding and bonding conductors or connection devices to enclosures.

4. The title and content of the section includes the term "bonding" but then neglects to include the term in the last sentence. Obviously, if sheet metal screws are not adequate for connection of grounding conductors or connection devices, they would not be suitable for bonding connectors or connecting devices.

 

[George Stolz]

Re: 250.8 addition

Edit completely:

Good proposal.

I would change the wording to "...Sheet metal screws shall not be used to connect grounding conductors, bonding conductors, or connection devices to enclosures." I believe that to be a schosh clearer.

Good eye on that, Bryan!

[ September 06, 2005, 08:57 PM: Message edited by: georgestolz ]

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Re: 250.8 addition

But I can still use dry wall screws!!
Don

 

[bphgravity]

Re: 250.8 addition

"Sheet metal screws, drywall screws, wood screws, bubble gum, duct tape, electric tape, scotch tape, wood glue, super glue, elmer's glue, rubber bands, magnets, and telekinesis shall not be used..."

That should about cover it!

 

[George Stolz]

Re: 250.8 addition

But I can still use barbeque sauce!


What? It'll set up.

 

[LawnGuyLandSparky]

Re: 250.8 addition

Gorilla glue. Hands down the best glue on the market!

 

[iwire]

Re: 250.8 addition

How about this?

250.8 Connection of Grounding and Bonding Equipment.

Grounding conductors and bonding jumpers shall be connected by exothermic welding, listed pressure connectors, listed clamps, or other listed means. Connection devices or fittings that depend solely on solder shall not be used. Connection devices or fittings that depend on screws shall use screws of the machine thread type.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Re: 250.8 addition

Bob,
That is where I was going with my comment. We can't just use a list of what can't be used, because then anything not on the prohibited list is permitted. I submitted a proposal to require the use of machine screw threads for this application, but it was rejected by CMP 5.
Don

 

[George Stolz]

Re: 250.8 addition

Don, why was it rejected? The "machine thread" text Bob has seems to avoid the problem you cited.

 

[petersonra]

Re: 250.8 addition

The reason it was rejected is probably because they do not want to reject the possibility of something equally as good coming along.

suppose someone were to use a pop rivet type tool to attach a ground wire with a ring tongue terminal to a hole in a metal box? that would certainly be as effective as a machine screw and a lot cheaper to install.

 

[ryan_618]

Re: 250.8 addition

My understanding is that there is a task group in place to try to address this for the 2008 code. I might be mistaken on this though.

 

[iwire]

Re: 250.8 addition

Originally posted by petersonra:
suppose someone were to use a pop rivet type tool to attach a ground wire with a ring tongue terminal to a hole in a metal box? that would certainly be as effective as a machine screw and a lot cheaper to install.

Bob read my wording, it does not prevent using a pop rivit.

 

[Sparky2000]

Re: 250.8 addition

Pop rivets are often aluminum. As we know it is a very easily corroded metal. It is also highly ductile and we all remember what happened with 10 and 12 AWG aluminum wires because of that.

Any grounding or bonding method should be approved before it is used.

 

[tom baker]

Re: 250.8 addition

I don't really want to see 250.8 changed, I have too much fun with it in my classes!.
The wording is backwards. Could always add listed or approved, EG shall use machine screws or othe listed devices.

 

[electricmanscott]

Re: 250.8 addition

If you want to be conistent with the NEC all you have to do is follow sheet metal screws with "Or similar type screws". That could mean just about anything thereby covering all the bases.

 

[iwire]

Re: 250.8 addition

Originally posted by electricmanscott:
If you want to be conistent with the NEC all you have to do is follow sheet metal screws with "Or similar type screws". That could mean just about anything thereby covering all the bases.

I'm picking up your sarcasm.