320.23 in non accessible attics

[betsy]

Am I understanding the code correctly?? Section 334.23 says that it shall comply with 320.23. Does this mean that I can attach type nm cable to the tops of rafters as long as I am at least 6 ft from the access hole??

 

[jwelectric]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

To run it across the TOP of the rafter might make it a little hard to install the sheeting on the roof

 

[George Stolz]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

Yes.

In spaces where HVAC equipment is present, and a floor is built for servicing that equipment, you need to protect for 7' around that floor.

Otherwise, if NM is installed within 6' of the attic access, it would be need to be protected by running boards where it crosses the tops of the rafters (as in, where you would step or place items for storage).

 

[jwelectric]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

I think that where George is talking about is the ceiling joist.

 

[George Stolz]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

I say potato, you say potatoe,
I say tomato, you say tomatoe...

I consider "joists" things like 2x12's, whereas rafters are generally engineered and built of 2x4's.

What whatever you call it, the original poster is probably on our wavelength.

 

[jwelectric]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

Originally posted by georgestolz:

I consider "joists" things like 2x12's, whereas rafters are generally engineered and built of 2x4's.

These are trusses

The joist runs parallel with the floor. The rafter is what determines the pitch of the roof.

I can not resist the chance to pick on George today just because I like him.

 

[rattus]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

Rafters are the framing members immediately under the roof decking-usually 2x6s.

Ceiling joists are horizontal framing members which support the attic floor and ceiling sheetrock--usually 2x6s.

Studs are the vertical wall framing members--usually 2x4s.

Floor joists are horizontal framing members which support the floor--2x6s or larger.

 

[jim k]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

Originally posted by rattus:
Rafters are the framing members immediately under the roof decking-usually 2x6s.

Ceiling joists are horizontal framing members which support the attic floor and ceiling sheetrock--usually 2x6s.

Studs are the vertical wall framing members--usually 2x4s.

Floor joists are horizontal framing members which support the floor--2x6s or larger.

All true if the roof is stick-framed.

If the roof is framed with trusses, there are no rafters or joists. The top and bottom members are called "chords" (the intermediate members are the "webs").

In her original question Betsy was, I'm sure, talking about either the top of the ceiling joists or the top of the bottom chords.

Though I doubt that anyone misunderstood what she meant.

- Jim K

 

[LarryFine]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

And people wonder how 5-page threads grow from "simple" questions!

 

[betsy]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

so in other words, to run the wire on the top of the rafters (the boards that hold ceiling) I would either need to install running boards or bore holes. You guys got me confused with the rafter/truss business. I am talking about an unaccessible attic where there will to my knowledge be NO access for storage.

 

[rattus]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

Betsy,
I would bet that the carpenters who install these trusses still distinguish between rafters and joists. You are talking joists. I would also say that the rule applies if there is a scuttle hole because people will store things in these little nooks and crannies even if they can't get their bods up there.

 

[monkey]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

"To run it across the TOP of the rafter might make it a little hard to install the sheeting on the roof"

Isn't that what nail plates are for?

 

[redfish]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

so in other words, to run the wire on the top of the rafters (the boards that hold ceiling) I would either need to install running boards or bore holes. You guys got me confused with the rafter/truss business. I am talking about an unaccessible attic where there will to my knowledge be NO access for storage.

</font>

• <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If by unaccessible, you simply mean a void between the ceiling and the roof with no way to gain access to this space, then yes you can run wire on top of the ceiling joists, just remember 300.4(D). </font>

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">edited for spelling.

[ August 28, 2005, 11:03 PM: Message edited by: redfish ]

 

[George Stolz]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

Originally posted by betsy:
I am talking about an unaccessible attic where there will to my knowledge be NO access for storage.

If there is an attic access, the attic is accessible. And you thought you were confused.

 

[raider1]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

IRC R807.1, says "In buildings with combustible ceiling or roof construction, an attic access opening shall be provided to attic areas that exceed 30 square feet and have a vertical height of 30 inches."

So unless this is a small space it needs to have an access. Also if it is constructed of engineered trusses you could not drill or notch any of the framing members, unless the engineer approved it.

Chris.

 

[redfish]

Re: 320.23 in non accessible attics

betsy said,

so in other words, to run the wire on the top of the rafters (the boards that hold ceiling) I would either need to install running boards or bore holes. You guys got me confused with the rafter/truss business. I am talking about an unaccessible attic where there will to my knowledge be NO access for storage.

If betsy was told that there would be no access, then how would betsy know where the access would be?