Abbreviation for ground and green

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wmabantajr

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Does the NEC define an abbreviation for ground and green? I used GRN on a schematic connecting the ground terminal on the devices to the MC cable. Problem is I used MCAP cable which bonds the metal box when it's attached using MCI-A fittings. I'm also using self-grounding devices so phyiscally there is no green ground wire and I'm getting harashed by an inspector saying the GRN means green and he he expected to see a green wire. I understand it's wired in accordance with the NEC but they have additional grounding requirements that I wasn't aware of and they are hanging their hat on the fact that my schematic says GRN and states that there is a code that says GRN is ground. Is there said code?
 
wmabantajr said:
Does the NEC define an abbreviation for ground and green? I used GRN on a schematic connecting the ground terminal on the devices to the MC cable. Problem is I used MCAP cable which bonds the metal box when it's attached using MCI-A fittings. I'm also using self-grounding devices so phyiscally there is no green ground wire and I'm getting harashed by an inspector saying the GRN means green and he he expected to see a green wire. I understand it's wired in accordance with the NEC but they have additional grounding requirements that I wasn't aware of and they are hanging their hat on the fact that my schematic says GRN and states that there is a code that says GRN is ground. Is there said code?
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I have never heard of a code that dictated abbreviations. I have been working with abbreviations for decades and have electrical books that go back to the 60's.

This is what I saw in print:

G, GN, GRN = Green

GND = Ground
 
wmabantajr said:
Does the NEC define an abbreviation for ground and green?
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No, and the NEC does not use the word ground.

It's Equipment Grounding Conductor EGC

Or Grounding Electrode Conductor GEC

Or Grounded conductor

Or ungrounded conductor.

Using just the word ground leaves things undefined.
 
wmabantajr said:
Does the NEC define an abbreviation for ground and green? I used GRN on a schematic connecting the ground terminal on the devices to the MC cable. Problem is I used MCAP cable which bonds the metal box when it's attached using MCI-A fittings. I'm also using self-grounding devices so phyiscally there is no green ground wire and I'm getting harashed by an inspector saying the GRN means green and he he expected to see a green wire. I understand it's wired in accordance with the NEC but they have additional grounding requirements that I wasn't aware of and they are hanging their hat on the fact that my schematic says GRN and states that there is a code that says GRN is ground. Is there said code?
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Unless you're required to exceed the NEC this seems silly to me that you need a green EGC because the letters GRN appear on the schematic. Can you post a photo of the schematic?
 
wmabantajr said:
I understand it's wired in accordance with the NEC but they have additional grounding requirements that I wasn't aware of and they are hanging their hat on the fact that my schematic says GRN and states that there is a code that says GRN is ground. Is there said code?
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Who are "they"? If they are code enforcement then they should cite an article and section you are violating, if they are an owners inspector or QC person it might be more of a problem.

Roger
 
Is this in a patient care area of a hospital?

Roger
 
wmabantajr said:
Does the NEC define an abbreviation for ground and green? I used GRN on a schematic connecting the ground terminal on the devices to the MC cable. Problem is I used MCAP cable which bonds the metal box when it's attached using MCI-A fittings. I'm also using self-grounding devices so phyiscally there is no green ground wire and I'm getting harashed by an inspector saying the GRN means green and he he expected to see a green wire. I understand it's wired in accordance with the NEC but they have additional grounding requirements that I wasn't aware of and they are hanging their hat on the fact that my schematic says GRN and states that there is a code that says GRN is ground. Is there said code?
Click to expand...
It is clear to me that the design wanted a cable with an EGC of the wire type.

Maybe it was just based on old specs from before the MCAP cable was on the market, but maybe the designer wanted the EGC to be of the wire type.
 
wmabantajr said:
See attached schematic.
Click to expand...

As drawn, with BLK, WHT, GRN in the same 'column', by context GRN would mean green. If the schematic said HOT, NTL, GRN, by context I would read that as hot, neutral, ground.

Although I can't see any code violation, I do think the drawing should be changed to offer more clarity and to reflect the actual installation. It's quite common to issue 'as builts' and this may be a situation where one may be in order.

When I look at the schematic, I am seeing the conductors as being required to be black, white and green.
 
don_resqcapt19 said:
It is clear to me that the design wanted a cable with an EGC of the wire type.

Maybe it was just based on old specs from before the MCAP cable was on the market, but maybe the designer wanted the EGC to be of the wire type.
Click to expand...

The schematic clears shows MC-ap cable.
 
Reissue the drawing with a legend which explains what your abbreviations mean.
 
I deleted the post that contained the drawing. It has a clear statement to the effect that the information it contains is proprietary, and that the drawing may not be reproduced in any way without permission.

Having seen that on the drawing implies that I also saw the drawing. I agree with K8MHZ in that the drawing is calling for the wires to be black, white, and green. But the distinction between an EGC being a green insulation wire or being any other approved wiring method is not significant, in terms of how it will do its job. I suggest covering this with some type of paperwork that will appease the inspector. Perhaps an RFI to the designer of record would do the job.
 
Does this help?
250.126 Identification of Wiring Device Terminals. The
terminal for the connection of the equipment grounding
conductor shall be identified by one of the following:
(1) A green, not readily removable terminal screw with a
hexagonal head.
(2) A green, hexagonal, not readily removable terminal nut.
(3) A green pressure wire connector. If the terminal for the
grounding conductor is not visible, the conductor entrance
hole shall be marked with the word green or ground, the
letters G or GR, a grounding symbol, or otherwise identified
by a distinctive green color. If the terminal for the
equipment grounding conductor is readily removable, the
area adjacent to the terminal shall be similarly marked.
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While it has nothing to do with drawings (the code does not have drawing standards contained in it), it does allow "G" or "GR" to identify an equipment grounding terminal.

As far as I am concerned on your drawings you can call it whatever you want as long as there is a key telling the user what it means. It is a whole lot easier if it makes sense though.
 
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