Been reading from this site and got a lot of useful information. I would appreciate if someone could point me in the right direction with regards to bonding a permanent above ground pool (over 42"). I've been told to run the #8 cu aound the frame hitting every other strut; then I was told that because of the aluminum sides, I did not have to hit every other strut, just attach to one and it will be bonded. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
above ground swimming pool bonding
- Thread starter flhtclark
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jimwalker
Senior Member
- Location
- TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: above ground swimming pool bonding
Would get a ruling from AHJ as that is a judgement call and not in NEC.Don't forget about all the other items within 5 ft.Seen one case where a window had to be bonded.
Really can't see why all above grounds should not meet bonding,them big ones won't be moved till they rust away.
Would get a ruling from AHJ as that is a judgement call and not in NEC.Don't forget about all the other items within 5 ft.Seen one case where a window had to be bonded.
Really can't see why all above grounds should not meet bonding,them big ones won't be moved till they rust away.
ryan_618
Senior Member
- Location
- Salt Lake City, Utah
Re: above ground swimming pool bonding
The term "strut" is one that I'm not familiar with. Is that the same as rebar? IF so, you will use the rebar as the "grid" with your #8. I would highly suggest that you read article 680, and read it well. There are many, many provisions that must have be complied with.
Jim: The answer to your question can be found in the fine print note to section 680.26...it is equipotential bonding to avoid the possibilities of a voltage gradient.
The term "strut" is one that I'm not familiar with. Is that the same as rebar? IF so, you will use the rebar as the "grid" with your #8. I would highly suggest that you read article 680, and read it well. There are many, many provisions that must have be complied with.
Jim: The answer to your question can be found in the fine print note to section 680.26...it is equipotential bonding to avoid the possibilities of a voltage gradient.
stamcon
Senior Member
- Location
- South San Francisco CA
Re: above ground swimming pool bonding
Ryan, the struts are the vertical supports that run around the perimeter, supporting the walls/liner(this is an above ground pool).
[ January 29, 2004, 12:58 AM: Message edited by: stamcon ]
Ryan, the struts are the vertical supports that run around the perimeter, supporting the walls/liner(this is an above ground pool).
[ January 29, 2004, 12:58 AM: Message edited by: stamcon ]
jimwalker
Senior Member
- Location
- TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: above ground swimming pool bonding
Ryan i don't see it.I am on pages 531 and 532 binder style
all of these pages apply to II permanently installed.
What am i missing? just when does a storable pool III need to be called permanent.I have a friend with one of these so called storables and it hasn't move in over 5 years.Should we be doing something about this?
And struts are not rebar but are part of the main frame, so basically about the same for bonding purpose.
Ryan i don't see it.I am on pages 531 and 532 binder style
all of these pages apply to II permanently installed.
What am i missing? just when does a storable pool III need to be called permanent.I have a friend with one of these so called storables and it hasn't move in over 5 years.Should we be doing something about this?
And struts are not rebar but are part of the main frame, so basically about the same for bonding purpose.
ryan_618
Senior Member
- Location
- Salt Lake City, Utah
Re: above ground swimming pool bonding
Sorry guys...I missed the "above ground" part.
Sorry guys...I missed the "above ground" part.
jimwalker
Senior Member
- Location
- TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: above ground swimming pool bonding
No problem Ryan ,and it did do some good as i caught something we are violating and will fix this weekend.While the above ground isn't required bonding ,we are using a hard wired motor,So i think we should bring this pool into compliance with PERMANENT or put a cord back on it and use gfci.
No problem Ryan ,and it did do some good as i caught something we are violating and will fix this weekend.While the above ground isn't required bonding ,we are using a hard wired motor,So i think we should bring this pool into compliance with PERMANENT or put a cord back on it and use gfci.
Re: above ground swimming pool bonding
To be more clear; I'm quoting from the 2002 NEC that says in the definitions of 680 that a "Permanently Installed Swimming, Wading, and Therapeutic Pool" is that which is constructed in the ground or PARTIALLY in the ground, and ALL others capable of holding water in a depth greater than 42". So is an aluminum sided above ground pool considered this. They do partially go into the ground for the sand base for the liner. The standard depth is 48". I would think that they are. I will check with my Inspect. also. I hope that this clears up the question.
Stamcon is correct for how I used the term "strut"
Thanks again
To be more clear; I'm quoting from the 2002 NEC that says in the definitions of 680 that a "Permanently Installed Swimming, Wading, and Therapeutic Pool" is that which is constructed in the ground or PARTIALLY in the ground, and ALL others capable of holding water in a depth greater than 42". So is an aluminum sided above ground pool considered this. They do partially go into the ground for the sand base for the liner. The standard depth is 48". I would think that they are. I will check with my Inspect. also. I hope that this clears up the question.
Stamcon is correct for how I used the term "strut"
Thanks again
Re: above ground swimming pool bonding
Also, Thanks ryan. I read 680.26. particularly section c-2 that deals with the common bonding grid and lists (2) as "The wall of a bolted or welded metal pool". Of course the strut would mount to the wall by bolts. I still have the question of how many or is it just one strut that I hit with the #8.
Thanks again
Also, Thanks ryan. I read 680.26. particularly section c-2 that deals with the common bonding grid and lists (2) as "The wall of a bolted or welded metal pool". Of course the strut would mount to the wall by bolts. I still have the question of how many or is it just one strut that I hit with the #8.
Thanks again
jimwalker
Senior Member
- Location
- TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: above ground swimming pool bonding
If the wall is 1 piece i think 1 place would do fine. just my opinion.
If the wall is 1 piece i think 1 place would do fine. just my opinion.
electricman2
Senior Member
- Location
- North Carolina
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
Re: above ground swimming pool bonding
As long as all the structural metal framework is solidly fastened together I see no problem with one connection point but as has been pointed out, It never hurts to check with the AHJ
As long as all the structural metal framework is solidly fastened together I see no problem with one connection point but as has been pointed out, It never hurts to check with the AHJ
pierre
Senior Member
- Location
- Westchester County, New York
Re: above ground swimming pool bonding
As far as BONDING this above ground pool, the NEC only requires it in one location. I myself (this is my personal belief) would tend to bond it in more places as the problem of stray voltage in the earth is becoming more prevalent these days. Anyone who lives in high lightning areas should think about this also.
Jim before you start altering the motors to the pool, UL is very, very restrictive as to the requirements of altering any pool pump motors.
Swimming Pool And Spa Equipment (WABX)
There are more than 5 pages of small print requirements of pool equipment.
Here is a little:
PUMPS (WCSX)
Pumps investigated for storable pools are so identified and are additionally marked"DO NOT USE WITH PERMANENTLY INSTALLED POOLS".
Pumps investigated for permanently installed pools are so identified and are additionally marked "DO NOT USE WITH STORABLE POOLS".
The capital lettering is by UL, not me. Quoted from page 114 of the General Information for Electrical Equipment 2003. (the 2004 version does not come out until later this spring)
If you are concerned, and you should be, change the motor to a listed motor.
Pierre
As far as BONDING this above ground pool, the NEC only requires it in one location. I myself (this is my personal belief) would tend to bond it in more places as the problem of stray voltage in the earth is becoming more prevalent these days. Anyone who lives in high lightning areas should think about this also.
Jim before you start altering the motors to the pool, UL is very, very restrictive as to the requirements of altering any pool pump motors.
Swimming Pool And Spa Equipment (WABX)
There are more than 5 pages of small print requirements of pool equipment.
Here is a little:
PUMPS (WCSX)
Pumps investigated for storable pools are so identified and are additionally marked"DO NOT USE WITH PERMANENTLY INSTALLED POOLS".
Pumps investigated for permanently installed pools are so identified and are additionally marked "DO NOT USE WITH STORABLE POOLS".
The capital lettering is by UL, not me. Quoted from page 114 of the General Information for Electrical Equipment 2003. (the 2004 version does not come out until later this spring)
If you are concerned, and you should be, change the motor to a listed motor.
Pierre
Re: above ground swimming pool bonding
Just to follow up; I spoke with the inspector today while making a payment for a service inspection. He said that they like to see the above ground pool bonded in two locations on the pool and then back to the motor. I asked if hitting the pool strut closest to the motor and then running the #8 half way around the pool to another strut was all right and he said that it was. He did remind me about using the correct lugs and screws for holding the wire.
Thanks for all your help. I look forward to other discussions.
By the way, I'm in Northeast Pa. I don't know what other inspectors would say.
Thanks again
Just to follow up; I spoke with the inspector today while making a payment for a service inspection. He said that they like to see the above ground pool bonded in two locations on the pool and then back to the motor. I asked if hitting the pool strut closest to the motor and then running the #8 half way around the pool to another strut was all right and he said that it was. He did remind me about using the correct lugs and screws for holding the wire.
Thanks for all your help. I look forward to other discussions.
By the way, I'm in Northeast Pa. I don't know what other inspectors would say.
Thanks again
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