Adventures in Wire Pulling: The Ongoing Saga of our Damaged Feeders

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Jon456

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Colorado
For those who have been following this story, the (mis)adventure continues. :weeping:

Brief backstory: As part of our 1MW solar project 19 months ago, the installing contractor pulled our existing (16) 500 MCM aluminum main feeder wires (480V/1,000A, 3-phase wye) into two in-ground conduits, damaging the insulation in the process. Two months ago, one conduit shorted out (destroying all wires within) and the other conduit was tested as having three damaged wires. After threats of legal action, the contractor finally agreed to replace the feeders. We opted to switch from (16) 500 MCM aluminum wires in two conduits, to (8) 400 MCM copper wire in one conduit (derating our service from 1,000A to 600A); we agreed to pay the $10K cost difference for this new copper XHHW wire. The contractor wanted a more experienced and skilled crew to do the new pulls, so he subbed the wire pulling part of the job to another contractor; the original contractor made the splices at the in-ground pull box.

The job was done last Friday. The wire was installed in two separate pulls: a 200' section from the distribution panel to the mid-point in-ground pull-box, and a 160' section from the switch gear to the pull-box. The wire was spliced at the pull-box. Before putting the feeders in service, we had an independent testing company perform insulation resistance tests on all the replaced wires (which, btw, the contractor objected to). One of the eight new 400 MCM copper wires tested low resistance to ground (~50K ohms). The splice at the mid-point pull-box was cut and the two sections of wire tested separately. Each section tested bad. Both the contractor and sub-contractor are of the opinion that the wire was defective from the distributor based on the fact that when they cut the splice out, they discovered a light coating of black oxidation on the copper wire's strands suggesting that water had intruded into the wire before it was sold.

Because the work was scheduled on a Friday, our options to resolve the problem were limited. The contractor's immediate "fix" was to change this wire from being a 480V phase conductor to being a neutral conductor, which we agreed would be an acceptable short-term solution. The contractor is currently discussing the problem with the wire distributor, but so far has not made any arrangements to replace the wire. In fact, so far he has not even conceded that the wire should be replaced. Based on comments made Friday, our expectation is that he will try to justify leaving the wire as-is and calling the job completed.

Questions:

1. Is it code-compliant to have a neutral feeder in service that has failed insulation resistance testing?

2. If it is not prohibited, what are the long-term issues with using this wire as a neutral inside buried conduit filled with brackish water?

3. If you were the customer who had paid for the installation of new copper wire, would you be willing to accept this damaged feeder?
 
Wow.


110.7 Wiring Integrity. Completed wiring installations shall be free from short circuits, ground faults, or any connections to ground other than as required or permitted elsewhere in this Code.
 
Thank you. That's what I thought, but I didn't know the code reference.

I have to admit I was questioning my own doubts about this wire because the contractor and sub-contractor both were trying to convince us that it was perfectly acceptable to use this wire as a neutral conductor. The sub even tossed out an anecdote about how the utility used to direct-bury bare service neutrals.
 
Thank you. That's what I thought, but I didn't know the code reference.

I have to admit I was questioning my own doubts about this wire because the contractor and sub-contractor both were trying to convince us that it was perfectly acceptable to use this wire as a neutral conductor. The sub even tossed out an anecdote about how the utility used to direct-bury bare service neutrals.

1. The utility operates under the NESC rather than the NEC and.
2. The utility has engineers designing their systems, not GCs.
:)

Tapatalk!
 
Yeah, I knew it was a bogus argument because the utilities play by distinctly different rules. Also, what is allowed upstream of the main service disconnect doesn't apply downstream. But when they started "baffling us with BS," they introduced enough confusion that I had to come here to get my mind set straight. :ashamed1:
 
Did they do anything to verify the condition of the conduit before pulling the new wire in? Or did they just pull the old out and the new in?

Keep us updated, this has to be one of the biggest clusters I've heard of.
 
More like WOW

What a cluster ....

No one purged or cleaned the conduit before installing new wire...
HOW can anyone think that a conduit has not been damaged after a fault of that magnitude?
Faults in sand will make glass.

glass is a good insulator... maybe if we washed sand into the pipes with salt
water, it'd heal itself?

my flusters are fully clucked on this one, and my BS filter is clogged.

can somebody just shoot the subcontractor, in the public good?
given his antics on this work, murder one would probably be reduced to littering,
unless you picked up the body.
 
I'm not sure how they think they can justify a "leaky" wire. You hired them to pull in new XHHW and when tested, it was damaged. Bad pipe, bad technique, bad wire(?), really doesn't matter. It's ain't what you ordered. ("If I'd wanted a bare neutral, I'd have ordered a bare neutral.")
 
Id replace all of it. If the threat for legal action came in once that's an excuse to fix everything.


Id too question the integrity of that conduit.
 
I don't know what the loads are for this project, but I would rather have a failed ungrounded conductor rather than a neutral. Probability is high for more damaged equipment from a neutral than a damaged phase conductor.
Regardless, the conductor should be replaced.

Wait, I think I would make them pull all the conductors out and check the conduit as has been said! Plus pulling out/in just one conductor might be hard and could cause further damage to the conductors.
 
glass is a good insulator... maybe if we washed sand into the pipes with salt
water, it'd heal itself?

my flusters are fully clucked on this one, and my BS filter is clogged.

can somebody just shoot the subcontractor, in the public good?
given his antics on this work, murder one would probably be reduced to littering,
unless you picked up the body.

:lol::lol::lol::rotflmao:
 
More like WOW

What a cluster ....

No one purged or cleaned the conduit before installing new wire...
HOW can anyone think that a conduit has not been damaged after a fault of that magnitude?
Faults in sand will make glass.


From what I have seen many companies don't take cable pulling seriously. They assume that if you put a bunch of big dumb goons on the job everything will just work out.

The fact that the company that subbed the wire pull didn't test the cable themselves should tell you something.
 
Sorry for not providing more details in my original post. I could write a novel about this project, but didn't want to detract from my main question about using the low IR-tested wire as a neutral feeder.


No one purged or cleaned the conduit before installing new wire...
HOW can anyone think that a conduit has not been damaged after a fault of that magnitude?
Faults in sand will make glass.


If you've been following the story of this project from 1.5 years ago, you will know that the installation contractor never cleaned, proofed, inspected, or lubricated our 15-year-old conduit (that had its opening buried under mud) before he pulled the original (16) 500 MCM aluminum wires. That is one of the reasons those wires failed. After those aluminum wires shorted and were pulled out, we (not the installation contractor) bought a 4" flexible rubber disc mandrel and pulled it through the conduit. In addition to some mud and sand, a handful of rocks came out of that conduit. We (not the installation contractor) also hired a company to borescope the conduit. Even thought all eight feeders in that conduit had literally blown apart, the conduit had no damage along its entire length.


This cleaning and inspection were done over a month ago when we were still battling the contractor over who was responsible for the damage to our feeders. A few days prior to the new copper wire pull on Friday, the contractor cleaned the conduit a second time by pulling through the rubber disc mandrel (which he borrowed from us, apparently because he figures he'll never need to swab any conduit on his other/future jobs so why buy his own).


So we do not believe the conduit was responsible for the fault in this one new copper wire.
 
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