AI to help prevent illegal construction

[ramsy]

Provided by Kaunas University of Technology

In summary:
Lithuania uses AI with UAV surveillance to find Illegal construction, based on exterior silhouette only.

One response may prompt a consumer market for Air-to-Air drone interceptions for tress passing.

We previously discussed google maps satellite view, for use by code enforcement to catch illegal activity, which resulted in google's imagery date function being promptly disabled.

The better method for catching illegal construction may be from the inside.

Any lookie loo can get access during property sales, when the public is invited to visually engorge upon the interiors.

If more licensed contractors went to open houses, and exercised their public right to report un-permitted additions & defects, that would put it on record at building departments, effectively creating the open permit that forces title companies to act, until permits & defects are resolved.

The real estate industry is liable for some of this process, appraisers are an authority having jurisdiction responsible for reporting defects, but with little incentive to do so.

Unless someone can point the way. Licensed contractors could certainly weaponize code enforcement by doing the leg work of otherwise sequestered city governments, de-funded regulatory agencies, and their penny-poor license boards.

 

[petersonra]

So you want people to rat them out in the hopes you will somehow get more business out of the ratting process?

What a wonderful human being you are.

 

[ramsy]

So you want people to rat them out

Guilty as Charged

Otherwise we are forced to live in a lawless regulatory environment

 

[drktmplr12]

from the homeowner's side, many people's entire savings exist in their home equity and usually when they are selling their house, they need to line up another house to move into and in short order. there are many moving parts. the last thing this society needs is hound dog contractors going around and getting in the way of home sales by filing complaints with building departments to force homeowners to close out permits to sell their houses. so now they need to find a contractor, submit permits for review, perform work, wait for inspections-we are talking months. THEN they can sell their house? Do they now need to worry about people touring the house posing as a prospective buyer instead there with the motive of trying to find defects and prevent the transaction? then they go back to the home owner and say hey i messed up your sale, i'm happy to provide you with a proposal to fix it.

from the contractor's side, why should they be interested in spending resources catching illegal contracting? it's a subset of the available market and during boom times-contractors need months, not weeks to mobilize, suggesting they have plenty of work without trying to convince owners who don't want permits in the first place to get them. during bust, they are just trying to stay afloat. are you suggesting they then pay an employee to go to open houses and try to torpedo a home sale and further prevent the sale of a home until a permit can be closed out because they perceive an improvement should have had a permit?

society is better off without this kind of system. it's just absurd to be suggesting contractors drive in the building department's lane.

solution looking for a problem here. status quo works. Caveat emptor

 

[drktmplr12]

also, building departments can and should use GIS data available to them to spot unauthorized additions. using drones to spot unauthorized work is an invasion of privacy IMO. GIS imagery is a grey area to me.

if there are new rooms that the property appraiser isn't aware of, this will be noted during the appraisal and the lender will not issue a loan. if its a cash transaction. well-no appraisal necessary and do your homework.

 

[ptonsparky]

I was contacted to do some PLC work for an MCC project I did not want. Another EC worked on the MCC with the stipulation he was not doing the control work. I called local State Electrical AHJ about how to permit it. Turned out no Electrical Permit was filed. New building. Both the inspector and the EC thought I had ratted. Neither appreciated it. Retired now, but nope, I'll let the Inspectors find their own issues.

 

[petersonra]

I was contacted to do some PLC work for an MCC project I did not want. Another EC worked on the MCC with the stipulation he was not doing the control work. I called local State Electrical AHJ about how to permit it. Turned out no Electrical Permit was filed. New building. Both the inspector and the EC thought I had ratted. Neither appreciated it. Retired now, but nope, I'll let the Inspectors find their own issues.

No one likes a rat.

 

[ramsy]

from the homeowner's side, many people's entire savings exist in their home equity

Property owner equity is currently exploited by insurance companies voiding claims for cause, fire hazard, electrical-code defect, missing building permits & inspections, delayed only by passing it along to next sucker.

Un-insurable construction defect is the poison pill rendering a complete loss, after insurances welch on all premiums paid.

..the last thing this society needs is hound dog contractors going around and getting in the way of home sales by filing complaints with building departments to force homeowners to close out permits to sell their houses.

Yes, protecting the lawless from themselves, so rigged insurance systems of "cancellation and non-renewal" can't get a free lunch.

..Do they now need to worry about people touring the house posing as a prospective buyer instead there with the motive of trying to find defects and prevent the transaction?

When selling things in open markets, public policy only works where enforced.

Village idiots caught and flogged in public are the best teachers, like the producers of poison dog food, and poison baby food, which recently forced US to get our baby food from Germany.

Why should socialist countries be the only safe place on Earth?

from the contractor's side, ..they have plenty of work without trying to convince owners who don't want permits in the first place to get them.

By overwhelming case precedent, the presumption of innocents no longer applies to lawless contractors, or their enablers for avoiding permits. Among other things, the court considers open permits an anti-competitive business practice when sentencing damages in favor of injured competitors.

If you ever visited a court room as a juror, its hard to ignore the new curse word.

Just framing your legal opponent in the presence of "unlicensed contractors" will evoke disruption in court rooms. Judge almost always yell back for clarification "Unlicensed Contractor", and entire the court rooms become silent.

are you suggesting they then pay an employee to go to open houses and try to torpedo a home sale and further prevent the sale of a home until a permit can be closed out because they perceive an improvement should have had a permit?

I'm suggesting license law require Continuing Education Units (CEU) to include Open House inspections that generate Open Permits.

Lets monetize the building department's function from the inside out, a grass-roots industry practice by trade licences visiting Open Houses.

 

[petersonra]

Property owner equity is currently exploited by insurance companies voiding claims for cause, fire hazard, electrical-code defect, missing building permits & inspections, delayed only by passing it along to next sucker.

Un-insurable construction defect is the poison pill rendering a complete loss, after insurances welch on all premiums paid.

has this EVER actually happened to a residential owner? the thing is that regardless of what the insurance contract might or might not say, the laws, rules, and regulations the state has in place regarding such insurance contracts completely trump what the contract says.

 

[ramsy]

it's just absurd to be suggesting contractors drive in the building department's lane.

solution looking for a problem here. status quo works. Caveat emptor

NO, real estate law requires "Cavet Venditor"

 

[ramsy]

has this EVER actually happened to a residential owner?

See for yourself

Taken from Herman & Wells:

We see smoke damage and fire claims denied for a wide range of reasons. Insurance companies will sometimes accuse their insureds of starting the fire intentionally. Other denials are based on “protective safeguard” policy forms, which insurance companies use to deny claims if there was no fire alarm or smoke detector. Denial letters cite to vacancy provisions, insurance application answers, and concealment provisions.

Policyholders who have experienced fire losses go through the worst combination of loss to their property and invasive investigation by their insurance company. Insurance companies will ask for financial records and a multitude of other documents. They will demand sworn testimony in the form of an Examination Under Oath. Some insureds are so worn down by the delay and intimidated by the investigation process that they give up their claims.

Taken from TetzelLaw.com

Fire insurance claims may be denied over errors made on a form or simply from lack of enough documentation that you are able to provide. The insurer, though, does have to offer an explanation for why your claim was denied.

If the reason was suspected arson or some fault of yours that the policy lists in its exclusion provisions, hire an independent investigator to undertake another investigation and prepare a written report if it is at odds with the insurer’s report and reason for denial. Your investigator should document that your home safety or fire alarm systems and smoke detectors were fully functioning and that your home was up to code. Once the report is complete, submit it for the insurer’s review. If it does not change their opinion, your policy will have provisions and instructions for filing an appeal.

 

[hbiss]

I have always thought ramsy works for the insurance industry. In just about any post he makes he has to bring up insurance issues.

-Hal

 

[ramsy]

I have always thought ramsy works for the insurance industry. In just about any post he makes he has to bring up insurance issues.

-Hal

Here is my instruction manual

2023 Cancellation & Nonrenewal Handbook

Cancellation & Nonrenewal outlines how insurers can legally terminate property & casualty insurance policies on a state-by-state basis for all 50 states and U.S. territories.

www.nationalunderwriter.com

 

[hbiss]

Why do you care? You are an EC, aren't you? Do your job and get paid. Let the owner worry about insurance issues.

-Hal

 

[mtnelect]

"The Wheels of Justice Are Slow But Sure". The process of Escrow in real estate put all the government enforcement to shame.
In California the Escrow process requires the seller to reveal any deficiencies in the property. The "Catch 22" is when the room addition was completed without a permit. When the appraisal is completed, it does not include the room addition. It is as if the room addition vanished.

 

[petersonra]

the insurance company has more discretion on non-renewal or refusing to insure but that is not the same thing as denying claims due to no permit. I have heard this over and over again that insurance companies are denying claims due to lack of permits and other similar issues, but never actually seen a documented case.

the link you cite seems to be more about deliberate fires or disputes about the extent of damage rather than no permit.

 

[rambojoe]

No one likes a rat.

Is that "rat" as in a snitch? Or a non union shop "rat"?

 

[drktmplr12]

NO, real estate law requires "Cavet Venditor"

straight from the Florida Realtors Association, approved by Florida Bar as-is sales contract used every day by just about every realtor in Florida, where the law is very much on the side of contractor's "right to repair"



the law requires you to disclose property defects of which one is aware. hiding facts that materially affect the value of the property is in direct conflict with this. if found, one should absolutely be compelled to make the buyer whole.

"protect the lawless from themselves?" Contractors take enough advantage of unsuspecting homeowners. Let's not give them another avenue during home sales. what is being suggested will quickly turn into unsuspecting homeowners being targeted by knowledgeable contractors; this exact information asymmetry that the seller's disclosure is meant to address. some hojo will make their living going around to open houses every weekend looking for mismatched receptacles and new vanities, air conditioners, waterheaters, etc and check for permits and then threaten to notify the building department there should have been a permit to disconnect and reconnect a sink, or replace receptacles, or god forbid someone installed recessed lights themselves. to what end? this virtue that we need to protect the next homeowner from getting a cancellation notice from their insurance company? sounds more like a system ripe for extortion, where those extorting the homeowner's equity are now contractors instead of insurance companies.

instead, lets use information already available to municipalities (time-stamped GIS data) to identify unpermitted additions and punish licensed (or unlicensed) contractors for performing them.

See for yourself

Taken from Herman & Wells:

Taken from TetzelLaw.com

no disrespect intended, but you are moving the goalpost from unpermitted work to insurance not paying for arson or agreeing with the scope of damages. I don't see how information pamphlets from law firms that make their living going after insurance disputes help the argument that contractors should be inspecting open houses for construction defects. also, why should an insurance company be made to pay for something they did not insure (an addition that they were not made aware of). surely the policy would have a higher premium if the house had one or two rooms added.

 

[petersonra]

Is that "rat" as in a snitch? Or a non union shop "rat"?

I thought non-union employees were called scabs, not rats.

 

[rambojoe]

I thought non-union employees were called scabs, not rats.

Call 'em what you want, jes dont call 'em late to dinner....
Here in good 'ol az/ca v.5.9... Its most definately rat.
P.s... Scabs was a waaay different time, for wiremen its rats... I guess..