AL TO CU

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timmermeier

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alton il
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electrician
HYPOTHETICAL QUESTON . can you splice al to cu in a listed junction box with WAGOS to make service conductors longer ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
 
1. Are Wagos rated for aluminum? If yes, then yes.

2. Are Wagos suitable for services? If yes, then yes.

3. Do they make Wagos that big? If yes, then yes.

If the answer to all three is yes, then yes.
 
Are you trying to rewire a house that's full of aluminum and trying to save what you can? Almost all your posts are on the subject.

Easiest way currently is alumicons and whatever you do don't splice service wires if you can avoid it. It's cheaper to just replace them
 
electrofelon said:
Keep in mind everyone's favorite 230.46 (if these are indeed service conductors he's talking about).
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Yes indeed. To the OP - you mention Service Conductors in the original post. Are you, perhaps, trying to extend branch circuit wiring?

Or do you really mean an actual Service Conductor - like a 4/0 AL wire? Roughly speaking the size of your thumb?
 
For a splice to allow you to transition between AL and CU, the following must be true about the connector:
1. It must be rated for both AL and CU
2. It must have a termination temperature rating that allows both wires to make a code-compliant termination at the ampacity desired.
3. It must allow the conductors to terminate independently to it, so that they don't directly connect to each other.

That last one would disqualify a split bolt, that doesn't have a separator bar. A split bolt connector would require the conductors to directly contact each other. It would also disqualify two circuits landing on the same snowman lug, even if the snowman lug is otherwise rated to carry that capacity of sizes. These examples of terminations, would require that both the CU and AL wires terminate to the same opening, which would put the dissimilar metals in direct contact.

Polaris blocks with independent ports for each wire, by contrast, would allow you to do this.
 
Ha ha - well that's a horse of a different color ;)

A 2 port Polaris, like Carultch says, would certainly work.

I am not a "real" electrician, but I have seen people here recommend these kinds of connectors for what you are talking about...

1710024931150.png

Downside is you need to be diligent about taping them up. Upside is you don't need to take a second mortgage out for buying a real Polaris. Last I looked at prices for a not-knockoff 2 port Polaris, sized for a 4/0 Service cable, they were close to $100 each.

The simple ones I pictured above have a block-off in the middle so, if you mix CU and AL, they won't ever touch.
 
Back to the OP, now that we clarified these are indeed service conductors: Sure no problem, but keep in mind that depending on what code cycle you are on, connectors on the line side of the service disconnect may need to be listed for that use. What happened was, the CMP's needed to come up with some other stupid new codes after the AFCI's and SPD's. Not wanting to make some much needed real changes like getting rid of some of the grounding and bonding BS in 250, they continued with the stupid stuff and picked something that had no history of problems or issues and is completely arbitrary. There wasnt even a standard to list them too for a long time. Some products are trickling onto the market, but there still are not that many.
 
electrofelon said:
Back to the OP, now that we clarified these are indeed service conductors: Sure no problem, but keep in mind that depending on what code cycle you are on, connectors on the line side of the service disconnect may need to be listed for that use. What happened was, the CMP's needed to come up with some other stupid new codes after the AFCI's and SPD's. Not wanting to make some much needed real changes like getting rid of some of the grounding and bonding BS in 250, they continued with the stupid stuff and picked something that had no history of problems or issues and is completely arbitrary. There wasnt even a standard to list them too for a long time. Some products are trickling onto the market, but there still are not that many.
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I'm thinking all the connector manufacturers seen what the AFCI/GFCI manufacturers have done and wanted to get in on some of the action as well, though this is kind of minor in comparison to the AFCI/GFCI thing.
 
LarryFine said:
Also depends on the amount of labor needed to replace an entire run.
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True but what are we looking at in a de-energized service in pipe so 1 hour labor or so i think 3 polaris will take almost as long if using a tourqe wrench and making it up nice and clean. Maybe if a cable service entrance it could be worth it but I hate using those and prefer something in some sort of raceway for this peticular part of the electrical system.

P.S. I absolutely hate having a crammed panel with big polaris jamed in and I hope that it's not some sort of splice in anything other than a trough adjacent to the panels. I'm not against doing a feeder but when I have to call a poco to energize to fix a splice it's not worth it when it could have been solid wire the whole way.
 
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