I have a situation in a house that belongs to a friend of a friend.. Their entire house is wired with aluminum wire and they are having problems with devices not working. (loose connections) I do not have much experience with aluminum wired homes... I know replacing the entire house with copper would be ideal, but I would like to find a safe alternative... IS using the copper to aluminum wire nuts w/ noox and pig tailing everything going to do the job???
Aluminum wired homes
- Thread starter willis t.
- Start date
- Status
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
willis t. said:
That is my preferred way of doing it. I have not had a problem with that method.
mdshunk
Senior Member
- Location
- Right here.
I can't really get on board with that, knowing what I know now. Once upon a time, I'd have said 'yes' to that. Now, I think that just replacing the devices with co/alr rated devices is probably at least as good as anything else you could do. Pigtailing with the purples causes you to jam the conductors harder back inside the box, which doesn't always work out so well with aluminium.willis t. said:
Brady Electric
Senior Member
- Location
- Asheville, N. C.
Aluminum wired homes
I agree with both responses only to add,be sure that in the outlets and switches you tighten down screws. (throughout the hole house)
In most houses that I have been in that have aluminum wire the screws are loose in the outlets and switches have arced and burned into.
Don't forget the breakers.
Semper Fi Buddy
I agree with both responses only to add,be sure that in the outlets and switches you tighten down screws. (throughout the hole house)
In most houses that I have been in that have aluminum wire the screws are loose in the outlets and switches have arced and burned into.
Don't forget the breakers.
Semper Fi Buddy
brian john
Senior Member
- Location
- Leesburg, VA
I would approach it as noted BUT.
If the friend plans to stay there a long time start rewiring a room at a time.
Safer and would help with resale later.
If the friend plans to stay there a long time start rewiring a room at a time.
Safer and would help with resale later.
M. D.
Senior Member
There is also this option never heard of them , they look a bit unwieldy to me but it is an option .
barbeer
Senior Member
- Location
- Pinellas County, FL
I own a home wired with AL and have not had a problem. I have replaced every device in the house and they all looked great, no evidence of heating.... I have added circuits with CU but that is only cause AL is not readily available and I do really prefer CU. I guess what I am trying to say is that it's not all bad.?
Aluminum wiring was popular in some areas in the mid to late 60's. Part of the problem with al when it was installed is that most installers (electricians) were not trained in proper installation practices. To my knowledge there were not any devices rated for al conductors at that time and over time there have been some problems. It can be repaired with listed fittings and devices but not knowing whats in the wall I would encourage your friend to rewire with copper if problems start to arise.
LarryFine
Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
- Location
- Henrico County, VA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
The main cause of loose connections with small-gauge aluminum is a combination of the fact that the aluminum is softer than the terminal metals, and that it has a high rate of expansion with heat.
Current flow heats up the wire, which flattens under the screw head, and removing the current allows the wire to cool. Subsequent current causes higher heat from the now-flattened wire, and it repeats.
Every time the connection heats up, it gets looser, which causes more heat. Now that the wire is flattened, a good re-tightening the terminals improves contact because of the increased contact area.
Current flow heats up the wire, which flattens under the screw head, and removing the current allows the wire to cool. Subsequent current causes higher heat from the now-flattened wire, and it repeats.
Every time the connection heats up, it gets looser, which causes more heat. Now that the wire is flattened, a good re-tightening the terminals improves contact because of the increased contact area.
K8MHZ
Senior Member
- Occupation
- Electrician
M. D. said:
They don't seem to be available any longer.
Sad, they were a cold weld crimp protected by shrink tubing. Sounded like a good idea, to me.
M. D.
Senior Member
The guy I talked to ,. said he thought these would be a good alternative , he has a few in his own house,.. been there two years , he checks them periodically no concerns as of yet
AlumiConn connectors and aluminum wire aluminum to copper lug connectors used for pigtailing or splicing may be observed in homes where aluminum wiring repairs have begun after about June 2007. [New in 2006, U.L. Listed, 2007 completed independent testing
AlumiConn connectors and aluminum wire aluminum to copper lug connectors used for pigtailing or splicing may be observed in homes where aluminum wiring repairs have begun after about June 2007. [New in 2006, U.L. Listed, 2007 completed independent testingohm
Senior Member
- Location
- Birmingham, AL
A few years ago I found a receptacle running at 300 deg f. on AL wire. The downstream lights were at half brilliance. The wire and connections looked fine but tested terrible. I pigtailed to CU with lots of NOLOX and have not heard of any further problems.
I did the best I could with what I had but I admit it was not up to Code. Looking into a correct fix turned into a joke. Even UL listed devices (Ideal) are comming under fire from various agencies. The listed CU/AL receptacles cost $3 each and as Marc pointed out pigtails are a problem.
I did the best I could with what I had but I admit it was not up to Code. Looking into a correct fix turned into a joke. Even UL listed devices (Ideal) are comming under fire from various agencies. The listed CU/AL receptacles cost $3 each and as Marc pointed out pigtails are a problem.
richxtlc
Senior Member
- Location
- Tampa Florida
The expansion and contaction of aluminum wire may be one cause of loose connections, the other is use of none AL or CU/AL switches, recepticals,etc.
If there are only CU switches, etc then oxidation of the aluminum wire is the problem as the aluminum acts as the anode and the copper the cathode. The aluminum becomes powdery and falls off due to normal use and becomes a loose connection.
This caused many fires when home owners replaced the switches and outlets with ones rated for CU only.
If there are only CU switches, etc then oxidation of the aluminum wire is the problem as the aluminum acts as the anode and the copper the cathode. The aluminum becomes powdery and falls off due to normal use and becomes a loose connection.
This caused many fires when home owners replaced the switches and outlets with ones rated for CU only.
charlietuna
Senior Member
if you consider everything mentioned here -- i think you'd be ok to pigtail copper using rated wire nuts and being careful not to overload the junction boxes with extra wire. most problems i have come across are homes wired with aluminum branch circuits and connected to the devices using the backstabs. when a splice is made properly and not overloaded it usually will last the lifespan of the home. for re-sale? i don't think the average house inspector would catch it -- and if he does--so what it is wired to code!
I'm going to have to agree with that one.
I also think that the listed AL wire nuts are a joke/scam.
Regular nuts were fine for many years then somehow became bad??? I don't think so. There is a lot of AL wiring in tract houses here built between 72 and 76 and the only issues I ever see are due to improper devices or somebody reworking it.
ohm
Senior Member
- Location
- Birmingham, AL
Well 220/221 I'll drink to that, but then again I'll drink to anything
B4T
Senior Member
- Location
- Long Island, N.Y.
AL/CU "Purple Wire Nuts"
AL/CU "Purple Wire Nuts"
The probem I found is every Electrical Inspection Agency I contacted about pigtailing won't sign-off on this option. Only COLAR devices will pass Inspection and get me a certificate. The wires in most boxes have to be stripped again to get a "clean" end. This means the wires are too short to make a loop for the device screw, so only option is to wirenut another piece of Aluminum Wire. Nothing worse than pulling the switch out of the wall and having 1 inch of wire to work with.
AL/CU "Purple Wire Nuts"
The probem I found is every Electrical Inspection Agency I contacted about pigtailing won't sign-off on this option. Only COLAR devices will pass Inspection and get me a certificate. The wires in most boxes have to be stripped again to get a "clean" end. This means the wires are too short to make a loop for the device screw, so only option is to wirenut another piece of Aluminum Wire. Nothing worse than pulling the switch out of the wall and having 1 inch of wire to work with.
76nemo
Senior Member
- Location
- Ogdensburg, NY
If I mention the Ideal 61-165 again, the moderators might think I am a spammer
You can measure the impedance of branch circuits with this tester. Seems like everyone here despises that tester, but to each their own. I bought that tester for this subject alone/AL wiring.
Everyone seems to think,..."Oh, that's just a little plug and play tester." No, I use the 61-183 adapter with it as well. I don't even like Ideal testing tools, not in the least, but I DO like the SureTest. It's the only thing from Ideal I own besides a CAT crimper and hand benders.
You can measure the impedance of branch circuits with this tester. Seems like everyone here despises that tester, but to each their own. I bought that tester for this subject alone/AL wiring.Everyone seems to think,..."Oh, that's just a little plug and play tester." No, I use the 61-183 adapter with it as well. I don't even like Ideal testing tools, not in the least, but I DO like the SureTest. It's the only thing from Ideal I own besides a CAT crimper and hand benders.
- Status