We have an interesting occurance i wonder if anyone has come across; within the last year our company wired several duplex apartments, all the same crew wired all the units. We just received a call from the mgmt company saying that when the tenant in the upstairs (these are stacked duplex apts) turns on her treadmill in the living room, that the downstairs bedroom arc trips. Now remenber that these are completely separate services only common by the 2 gang meter pack on the exterior of the building. The panels are cutler hammer ch style and are fed by se cable with 125a breaker for each in the meter pack. We are 100 miles from the site so i am hoping for some input prior to the travel. We had them plug it in by ext cord to the kitchen and then the problem doesnt occur. Any ideas?
Arc-fault
- Thread starter louis1
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brantmacga
Señor Member
- Location
- Georgia
- Occupation
- Former Child
possibly two wires from separate services sharing staples between the ceiling and floor?
CopperTone
Senior Member
- Location
- MetroWest, MA
unfortunately you might have to send someone out there to check it out. The first obvious thing to check is that they weren't accidentally wired on the same circuit. Then, verify that they are in fact in different panels. I would then try changing the phase of one of the breakers. last I would try changing out the arc fault breaker with a new one. After that - who knows?
It doesn't seem to make sense as you posed the problem - eliminate the above possiblilties first
It doesn't seem to make sense as you posed the problem - eliminate the above possiblilties first
thanks for the reply guys... The staple idea may be possible (although unlikely that could have occurred). And there is no possibility of the same circuit as the panels are completely separated and the living circuit of "a" is definitately not tied together with the bed circuit of "b"... Maintenance crew confirmed that. The first thing i did was contact tech support at eaton and they said to try changing the arc-fault and maybe separate (the distance between) the neutrals in the meter pack. I didnt think of trying switching the phases but definitely would have tried that once i get there. Any other ideas anyone? I will definitely post the findings tomorrow after my site visit
- Location
- Illinois
- Occupation
- retired electrician
Once wiring installation problems are ruled out, it should become the responsibility of the AFCI manufacturer to solve this issue. They have forced us to use products that are not really ready for use in the real world and they should absorb all of the costs in solving these types of problems. By putting these products into service before they were really ready, they have forced the home owners to do the beta testing for the AFCIs. ( I know that this will never happen, but it should.)
growler
Senior Member
- Location
- Atlanta,GA
First I have to assume that we are talking about a single unit with problems because not every tenant would have a treadmill.
If you only have one arc falt breaker having problems and hundreds of them working correctly I would just swap out this particular breaker with a new one and see if the problem is still there. The electronic circuitry in this one breaker may be fried and no telling what is causing it to trip.
If this problem is still present with a new breaker then try to find something common to both circuits.
I notice the mention of connecting an extension cord to a kitchen circuit that is a GFCI most likely, if done by code having no relevance to an AFCI BC. I would also connect that extension cord to a bedroom AFCI protected receptacle that is separate from the initial problem outlet to see if the AFCI down stairs trips again. If it does not trip... my first guess would be an adjacent routing in an upstairs AFCI underfloor run coupling with the downstairs close AFCI cabling ceiling run in the structure. That motorized tread mill can load up at immediate start up turn-on with a substantial induced field that affect cables of close proximate distant lengths along the same pathway.
I would also ask the adjoining tenants if they had loads running on that tripped circuit coincident with the treadmill time activation. Another WAG...consider there may be a harmonics interaction with simultaneous initiation between both circuits back to the main service (shared neutral) commonality if the subpanels 4-wire are not isolated.
K8MHZ
Senior Member
- Occupation
- Electrician
I seem to recall a similar thread in which it was discovered that some treadmills are not to be used on AFCI circuits.
Google 'treadmill afci' and you will see many complaints about treadmills tripping both afci and gfci devices.
Google 'treadmill afci' and you will see many complaints about treadmills tripping both afci and gfci devices.
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