Arc Flash NFPA-70E

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davidr43229

Senior Member
Location
Columbus, Oh
I am curious as to how many of you have incorporated Arc Flash Training into your course.
What year or level do you introduce it?
If you have a lab, are the components on the trainer-board touch-proof?
 
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bkludecke

Senior Member
Location
Big Bear Lake, CA
Occupation
Retired Electrical Contractor
I'm doing arc flash training as part of an overall NFPA 70E training seminar (4hrs). No lab though. I take materials right out of 70E plus alot of good info from the Bussmann Handbook. Great stuff.
 
RHaggie

RHaggie

Member
Location
Dallas TX
It's funny that you ask that question.
I provide the electrical safety training,but no NEC, for a large medical facility with all sorts of electrical workers- electricians, maintenance, A/C and X-ray technicians.
Just this week, one of the Journeyman electricians scoffed at the need for arc flash and safety training since he did not receive any of this sort of "new thing" during his apprenticeship 20 some odd years ago. He asked me why they didn't train him then if it was so important. I guess better late than never but that is the type of culture we live in.

Back in the 80's when I was studying for the Masters exam, I recall a Bussman presentation covering fault currents which was very good but nothing more. The amount of information available about electrcal safety is pretty good right now but the culture of doing things the way they always have is still with us.
I believe arc flash training is every bit as important as knowing how to size a motor feeder and OCP.
 
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davidr43229

Senior Member
Location
Columbus, Oh
Even the NJATC didn't incorporate NFPA-70E until just a couple of years ago.
This represents a "cultural" change and a recognition that hazards do exist. We have always know this, but to what degree?
Even OSHA in their 1910.XXX documents simply put that the worker had to be adaquately protected. from 1985 to 2002..... to what degree?
I would strongly encourage all Instructors to take a serious look and incorporate this.
Bob, if you ask, you probably could get a CD to make that easier.
 
ron

ron

Senior Member
Location
New York, 40.7514,-73.9925
Be careful when using the Bussmann information. It is really good, but be careful with the wonders of fuses vs breakers, because the differences are not always so great.
The fact that you replace all your existing fuses with current limiting fuses, or replace your breakers with CL fuses, doesn't help in many instances. There are lots of instances, especially at fault currents less than 30-40kA, and high nominal ampacity, where a breaker will operate first.
The Bussmann marketing Dept. is very good.
 
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bkludecke

Senior Member
Location
Big Bear Lake, CA
Occupation
Retired Electrical Contractor
The Bussmann book has alot of good generic info and charts right out of the NFPA 70E. It is alot more reader friendly. Of course they push their product types but I've been in this long enough to realize an add when I see one. I have no preference of fuses v c/bs (it depends on the application) but current limiting devices do have their place. Thanks for the input.
 
zog

zog

Senior Member
Location
Charlotte, NC
The bussmann materials are intended to be awareness training, not intended to meet the qualification requirements of the NFPA 70E, be careful about using the right terms.
 
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mikehughes8

Senior Member
Location
NC
I'm a newbie to the electrical field and have recieved some level of training with arc-flashes. Unfortunately, I have also witnessed an arc flash. One of my collegues was working in a Main distribution Panel. Panel was originally installed without box connectors and cable jacketing on one phase wore down over time. Manipulating the cable just enough cuased a short to ground.
He got burnt badly. It was a very bad experience. Needless to say, the transformer feeding the MDP should have been de-energized prior to starting work. I was some 20' away cutting 240mm cable of a cable reel. This is the hard way and the wrong way to learn about electrical safety.
 
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davidr43229

Senior Member
Location
Columbus, Oh
Mike,
Welcome to the board here. While it's an exciting field, it's also a dangerous field. The NFPA-70E was put into play to protect or reduce the amount of burns, deaths & injuries. As you stated, you saw this 1st hand and your friend, if he was badly burned probably underwent 3-5 surgeries the 1st week in the hospital, which "may" have been prevented.
The NFPA-70E is in it's infintacy here. Wait until it addresses "blast" and you will be wearing a "Breast-plate", which blast is not current addressed.
I wish you well in this field and again welcome.
Just my $.02
 
joe tedesco

joe tedesco

Senior Member
Location
Boston, Massachusetts
Nfpa 70e

Nfpa 70e

I think that 70E should be a part of all training from day 1, and throughout an electrician's career.

The text in some part of that document comes from th NEC, the numbers are different.

Here is a non-commercial link, and it has may files that also include electrical information:

http://www.com.edu/ce/riskmanagement_files.php

Here's one that reminds me of some of my travels.

http://www.com.edu/ce/riskfiles/OSHA%20General%20Industry/presentations/GI%202006%20Electrical.ppt

I use NEC 110.16 to cover the subject in detail, and the "meter" main, etc.

There are many videos that will help to make the subject clearer to those who are complacent and don't want anything to do with PPE.

You want pictures of dead people who were burned by arcs in electrical systems, let me know .. they always get the message across for sure.

Look here for the current status of the proposed revisions:

http://www.nfpa.org/aboutthecodes/AboutTheCodes.asp?DocNum=70E
 
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davidr43229

Senior Member
Location
Columbus, Oh
That's the clip from the Patrick Cudahy (meat packer in Milw) incident from Memorial Day weekend 2003, a security camera tape. I think the OSHA fine was in the $150k range, OSHA uses that clip a lot in their training in WI.
How can I get a copy? When doing my NFPA-70E seminars, I do not always have access to the internet
Dave
 
joe tedesco

joe tedesco

Senior Member
Location
Boston, Massachusetts
Make a clip using your digital camera

Make a clip using your digital camera

Use the video function on your digital camera and make a video.

I will work on it later and post it for those who want a copy.

Do a www.google.com search for a video and use electrical safety, accidents, arcs, explosions, etc, as the words:

http://www.whsalisbury.com/videos/im...production.wmv

PS: SquareD also has a Free DVD "It's a Matter of Your Safety" (UPDATED) now available call their Publications Office.

Here's a couple I just found.

http://video.yahoo.com/video/play?vid=1097666015&fr=b1ie7

http://www.infraredwindow.com/vids/arc_flash_movie.wmv
 
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